Holton 345 Redux
- The Big Ben
- 6 valves
- Posts: 3169
- Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:54 am
- Location: Port Townsend, WA
Re: Holton 345 Redux
Keep chipping away at it. It's looking good and you are going to be so glad when you have completed it so it is like you want it. Soooooon, sooooon...
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- 4 valves
- Posts: 534
- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:33 pm
- Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Re: Holton 345 Redux
+1
1930 King "Symphony" Recording Bass BBb
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
-
- 4 valves
- Posts: 534
- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:33 pm
- Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Re: Holton 345 Redux
Great work Elephant! Keep it going!
1930 King "Symphony" Recording Bass BBb
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
-
- 4 valves
- Posts: 534
- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:33 pm
- Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Re: Holton 345 Redux
First of all, congratulations on what you have achieved over the course of the last nine months as well as removing your self imposed deadline. The tuba will be finished to your satisfaction and you should be very proud of what you have accomplished. This thread with photos has provided so much learning for those such as myself who have absolutely no skills whatsoever in this area and therefore would never be able to take on such a gargantuan project. Your standards are very high and you are unwilling to compromise them. Bravo for that and bravo as well for knowing that this will come together to your satisfaction with hopefully much less stress for you. Well Done, Elephant!
Last edited by roughrider on Mon Mar 19, 2018 4:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
1930 King "Symphony" Recording Bass BBb
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
-
- 4 valves
- Posts: 534
- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:33 pm
- Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Re: Holton 345 Redux
Well Done!!
1930 King "Symphony" Recording Bass BBb
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
- roweenie
- pro musician
- Posts: 2165
- Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:17 am
- Location: Waiting on a vintage tow truck
- roweenie
- pro musician
- Posts: 2165
- Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:17 am
- Location: Waiting on a vintage tow truck
Re: Holton 345 Redux
I'm always looking for fresh ideas - could you post a photo?bloke wrote:I don't particularly like the "look" of it, but Jonathan's new buddy, Nickles, came up with a 4th valve routing (one one of their prototypes) where some of the #4 tubing traces the bottom bow along the upper part of the front. It's a low-damage area, and uses up a bunch of tubing really quickly. You could possibly end up with two upper-oriented #4 slides with such a routing: one in the typical spot, and another next to the front of the bell. Finally, it doesn't require the incredible precision of shape that does yet another tube fished around over the upper end of the valve block.
"Even a broken clock is right twice a day".
- roweenie
- pro musician
- Posts: 2165
- Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:17 am
- Location: Waiting on a vintage tow truck
Re: Holton 345 Redux
Makes for an "open wrap", but not quite my "cup of tea"....bloke wrote:Were I (??) to be influenced by this tack, this isn't quite what I would do, but here's the picture...roweenie wrote:I'm always looking for fresh ideas - could you post a photo?bloke wrote:I don't particularly like the "look" of it, but Jonathan's new buddy, Nickles, came up with a 4th valve routing (one one of their prototypes) where some of the #4 tubing traces the bottom bow along the upper part of the front. It's a low-damage area, and uses up a bunch of tubing really quickly. You could possibly end up with two upper-oriented #4 slides with such a routing: one in the typical spot, and another next to the front of the bell. Finally, it doesn't require the incredible precision of shape that does yet another tube fished around over the upper end of the valve block.
Last edited by roweenie on Sat Mar 31, 2018 8:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Even a broken clock is right twice a day".
- roweenie
- pro musician
- Posts: 2165
- Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:17 am
- Location: Waiting on a vintage tow truck
- roweenie
- pro musician
- Posts: 2165
- Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:17 am
- Location: Waiting on a vintage tow truck
Re: Holton 345 Redux
It looks as though you are orientating the top bow so that it is dead center to the bell plane - all the 6/4 Holtons I've seen have it slightly behind:
![Image](http://i345.photobucket.com/albums/p381/roweenie/Mobile%20Uploads/Screenshot_2018-04-01-14-07-12-1_zpsacbqo9tn.jpg)
I ran into a similar problem when I was putting together a 6/4 Holton that I received in parts. When I was finally able to see an original horn and observe how it was laid out, I had an "aha" moment.
Maybe that will help bring things a little more in line? (I say "maybe" because even "uncut" factory Holton branches tend to be pretty horrendous when it comes to "fit and finish".....)
![Image](http://i345.photobucket.com/albums/p381/roweenie/Mobile%20Uploads/Screenshot_2018-04-01-14-07-12-1_zpsacbqo9tn.jpg)
I ran into a similar problem when I was putting together a 6/4 Holton that I received in parts. When I was finally able to see an original horn and observe how it was laid out, I had an "aha" moment.
Maybe that will help bring things a little more in line? (I say "maybe" because even "uncut" factory Holton branches tend to be pretty horrendous when it comes to "fit and finish".....)
"Even a broken clock is right twice a day".
- roweenie
- pro musician
- Posts: 2165
- Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:17 am
- Location: Waiting on a vintage tow truck
Re: Holton 345 Redux
+1bloke wrote:It's going to turn out just fine.
"Even a broken clock is right twice a day".
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- 4 valves
- Posts: 534
- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:33 pm
- Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Re: Holton 345 Redux
roweenie wrote:+1bloke wrote:It's going to turn out just fine.
1930 King "Symphony" Recording Bass BBb
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
-
- 4 valves
- Posts: 534
- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:33 pm
- Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Re: Holton 345 Redux
Any news on your project?
1930 King "Symphony" Recording Bass BBb
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
-
- 4 valves
- Posts: 534
- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:33 pm
- Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Re: Holton 345 Redux
It is all good. Thanks for the reply.
1930 King "Symphony" Recording Bass BBb
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
-
- 4 valves
- Posts: 534
- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:33 pm
- Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Re: Holton 345 Redux
Any news?
1930 King "Symphony" Recording Bass BBb
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
-
- 4 valves
- Posts: 534
- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:33 pm
- Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Re: Holton 345 Redux
Thanks for your reply! It will be absolutely awesome when completed!!
1930 King "Symphony" Recording Bass BBb
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
-
- 4 valves
- Posts: 534
- Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:33 pm
- Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Re: Holton 345 Redux
How exciting! You're rolling now! I am really looking forward to hearing your thoughts after you play the completed horn for the first time!
1930 King "Symphony" Recording Bass BBb
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
1916 Holton "Mammoth" Upright Bass BBb
1994 King 2341 Upright Bass BBb
Wedge H2 Solo mouthpieces
Stofer-Geib mouthpieces
- BrassedOn
- bugler
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2018 10:00 am
- Location: Texas
Re: Holton 345 Redux
Impressive project. I'm with you on the finish. Need not be fabulous. I'm rid of my last silver plate horn, I have a trombone with sterling silver bell which I never shine, and it looks it, great, and another horn in satin silver aging nicely. Bah to polished silver, yeah for raw brass. Just stripped the last remnants off a Bach 42.
RE: patina....Over on TromboneChat, there are a couple threads on accelerating patina from eggs, vinegar, ammonia, to using a range of chemical reactions, to Palmolive dish soap. I'd try soap first because I think it can be controlled easily and no toxins. Another suggests a wax, to slow the patina formation but ends ultimately in more even patina. I've heard it mentioned before to once you do a patina treatment and rinse or whatever to complete the process, to leave it as long as you can (weeks) before handling to get the most even, deep patina. Like a good base finish before adding the effects of sweat.
https://www.trombonechat.com/viewtopic. ... tina#p7795" target="_blank
This is basically the mechanics of making a patina. Ingredients may differ. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vysWjIEYaQk" target="_blank
Some lacquer after they get the patina they want, to stabilize. Others let it continue to age.
Another way to go is brushed brass finish then cover in lacquer, your forte. Lawlor does this on his trombones. Shires too? I think there might be some online video for that. But much more work on a tuba, especially after assembly.
https://www.trombonechat.com/viewtopic. ... ish#p62878" target="_blank
RE: patina....Over on TromboneChat, there are a couple threads on accelerating patina from eggs, vinegar, ammonia, to using a range of chemical reactions, to Palmolive dish soap. I'd try soap first because I think it can be controlled easily and no toxins. Another suggests a wax, to slow the patina formation but ends ultimately in more even patina. I've heard it mentioned before to once you do a patina treatment and rinse or whatever to complete the process, to leave it as long as you can (weeks) before handling to get the most even, deep patina. Like a good base finish before adding the effects of sweat.
https://www.trombonechat.com/viewtopic. ... tina#p7795" target="_blank
This is basically the mechanics of making a patina. Ingredients may differ. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vysWjIEYaQk" target="_blank
Some lacquer after they get the patina they want, to stabilize. Others let it continue to age.
Another way to go is brushed brass finish then cover in lacquer, your forte. Lawlor does this on his trombones. Shires too? I think there might be some online video for that. But much more work on a tuba, especially after assembly.
https://www.trombonechat.com/viewtopic. ... ish#p62878" target="_blank
"Do less, better."
19xx? Blessing Sousaphone BBb
1970s King 3b Silver Sonic
1976 Fender Precision bass
19xx? Blessing Sousaphone BBb
1970s King 3b Silver Sonic
1976 Fender Precision bass
- BrassedOn
- bugler
- Posts: 115
- Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2018 10:00 am
- Location: Texas
Re: Holton 345 Redux
For some reason, "I've Got a Lovely Bunch of Cocoanuts" song came to mind.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nf670orHKcA" target="_blank" target="_blank
Okay, then I'll admit, having a well aged patina is as much as an aesthetic choice as having highly polished silver, either can be fabulous. In their own ways, they are asking for a long term dedication on the part of the player, with one requiring more labor intensive and the other extreme patience.
Again, great build thread.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nf670orHKcA" target="_blank" target="_blank
Okay, then I'll admit, having a well aged patina is as much as an aesthetic choice as having highly polished silver, either can be fabulous. In their own ways, they are asking for a long term dedication on the part of the player, with one requiring more labor intensive and the other extreme patience.
Again, great build thread.
"Do less, better."
19xx? Blessing Sousaphone BBb
1970s King 3b Silver Sonic
1976 Fender Precision bass
19xx? Blessing Sousaphone BBb
1970s King 3b Silver Sonic
1976 Fender Precision bass
- bort
- 6 valves
- Posts: 11223
- Joined: Wed Sep 22, 2004 11:08 pm
- Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota
Re: Holton 345 Redux
Principal horn = your wife?! ![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
(Jk, obviously you would have just said "my wife")
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
(Jk, obviously you would have just said "my wife")