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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Three Valves » Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:29 pm

That was a BAT alright!!
Who needs four valves??

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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Doc » Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:27 am

I’m excited to try the new kaiser next week. I’m afraid I’m going to really like it.

According to your description, it sounds like it plays like the typical kaiser - responds easily to direct input, does the work for you (man handling is counterproductive; can’t try to “play big” with it), has rich, dense, “core” sound, big yet clear (not pillowy).

I certainly love the York/BAT type of sound for some applications, but I’ve always loved the direct, clear, yet rich sound those long-belled tubas produce. I love my kaiser tuba, and it’s a shame more players in the US don’t embrace them. The new trend that is gaining traction is a BAT BBb, and that’s great, but the kaiser’s sound is unique and, from a purely sonic perspective, it is most certainly appropriate/warranted on many works. Yet many can’t get away from the York/BAT sound. I’m glad we have the freedom to choose, but I personally find it a shame more players don’t choose a kaiser type of BBb.

BTW, I played mine with my high school students yesterday in band. Stood on the gas in a few spots(not muscling it, just adding more fuel). There is no sharp ugly blatting when you get on it, but there is a nice clear edge that really defines the note.

The German tradition has remained tradition for many good reasons, the sound being the most obvious. Thanks to Jonathan and Chuck for taking the B&F holy grail of German Kaiser sound and refining and reproducing it today. I’m betting European sales are good. I hope they are here, too.

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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby bort » Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:54 am

I'm sure the $20k pricetag on the Siegfried isnt helping its popularity. Not that it isnt worth it... but when your budget is $20k, that covers about 99% of all tubas. So the Siegfried had better be THE tuba for you.
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Three Valves » Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:16 pm

Why don’t tuba players get “sponsored” the way violin and cello players do?? Those guys don’t own their 500k axes!!
Who needs four valves??

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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Mark Finley » Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:54 pm

My chair is sponsored. Didn't effect me one way or the other when it happened, but at least I'm sponsored and other chairs in the orchestra are unsponsored. (principal chairs)
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby toobagrowl » Fri Feb 08, 2019 8:22 pm

Not all Kaisers are the same. I have an old Kaiser BBb (prolly not as nice as Doc's) that has a very large .850" valve bore, a 20" bell with a very fat throat and about 41 or 42" tall. It has seen better days, but plays very well when the rotors are oiled and I use the right mpc. Kinda sounds like a Yorkbrunner; not as "direct" as some Kaisers, but still denser and more direct than the 6/4 York-a-phones. Other Kaisers are even "puffier" in sound than mine.
Just saying that due to their large typical 5/4+ ish size, they still have a lot of body to the sound and are not 'lazertone direct' :!:
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Doc » Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:54 pm

toobagrowl wrote:Just saying that due to their large typical 5/4+ ish size, they still have a lot of body to the sound and are not 'lazertone direct' :!:


Are they direct? Sure, but no laser beams zapping people’s heads off. Mine has a wide, rich sound, but without the buoyancy of a BAT. The right mouthpiece helps (most big kaisers prefer deep bowls). I tried several that worked, but I didn’t care for the rounded rims they featured. I turned a Sellmansberger Solo with extender ring and Profundo rim with a #2 backbore into a very fine kaiser mouthpiece. Rich sound with daisy-cutter capabilities.
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Doc » Sat Feb 09, 2019 12:14 am

You’ll be prepared next time. 8)
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Wyvern » Sat Feb 09, 2019 12:27 am

The Wessex Kaiser will be supplied with the type of funnel mouthpiece that is popular with German players to use with large Kaiser tubas. It is completely different to the 6/4 York tuba mouthpiece.

The unlacquered Kaiser we exhibited at DC is now with Mike Roylance to potentially use for Bruckner 9 performances with the Boston Symphony this next week. The Kaiser at TMEA will be a beautiful silver-plated example which has at last been found at Paris airport - and made its way over the Atlantic (together with new 3/4 BBb tuba).
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Chris Mayer » Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:07 pm

How does the Wessex compare to the Melton 197 or the original B&F ? Or in a bit more wider comparison with the likes of Alexander 164, Rudolf Meinl 5/4, Miraphone Hagen etc. ?

Would these other tubas even have a chance, as the Wessex, besides commercial advantages, is not only „based“ on legacy models but also an improved version and produced within an ever improving design, production and quality factory environment ? Why play the other oldfashioned and expensive stuff ?

As finally commercially and technically superior, remaining key challenge would only be to convince German tuba players to play chinese in their humba, symphonic or ensemble groups. (can be done, „made in germany“ has also finally worked out, maybe not as the British had initially intended...).

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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Wyvern » Tue Feb 12, 2019 1:25 pm

Chris Mayer wrote:How does the Wessex compare to the Melton 197 or the original B&F ? Or in a bit more wider comparison with the likes of Alexander 164, Rudolf Meinl 5/4, Miraphone Hagen etc. ?

Would these other tubas even have a chance, as the Wessex, besides commercial advantages, is not only „based“ on legacy models but also an improved version and produced within an ever improving design, production and quality factory environment ? Why play the other oldfashioned and expensive stuff ?

As finally commercially and technically superior, remaining key challenge would only be to convince German tuba players to play chinese in their humba, symphonic or ensemble groups. (can be done, „made in germany“ has also finally worked out, maybe not as the British had initially intended...).

Chris

Feedback received is the new Kaiser compares very favourable, but visit the Wessex booth at Frankfurt Musikmesse and judge for yourself. We are located next to Miraphone in the hall
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Liberty Mo » Tue Feb 12, 2019 2:01 pm

Wyvern wrote:The Wessex Kaiser will be supplied with the type of funnel mouthpiece that is popular with German players to use with large Kaiser tubas. It is completely different to the 6/4 York tuba mouthpiece.

The unlacquered Kaiser we exhibited at DC is now with Mike Roylance to potentially use for Bruckner 9 performances with the Boston Symphony this next week. The Kaiser at TMEA will be a beautiful silver-plated example which has at last been found at Paris airport - and made its way over the Atlantic (together with new 3/4 BBb tuba).


Just curious as to what other tubas Wessex will have at TMEA?
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby UncleBeer » Tue Feb 12, 2019 2:28 pm

Liberty Mo wrote:Just curious as to what other tubas Wessex will have at TMEA?


Kaiser
Chicago
Chicago "Presence"
Wyvern
Dragon
Viverna
Oregon (3/4 4 valve BBb)
Berg
Gnagey
Contra
French tuba
Imp (3/4 3 valve BBb)

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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Mark Finley » Tue Feb 12, 2019 2:33 pm

UncleBeer wrote:
Liberty Mo wrote:Just curious as to what other tubas Wessex will have at TMEA?


Oregon (3/4 4 valve BBb)


ok, I'll bite. what's the significance of the name?
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Doc » Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:02 pm

UncleBeer wrote:
Liberty Mo wrote:Just curious as to what other tubas Wessex will have at TMEA?


Kaiser
Chicago
Chicago "Presence"
Wyvern
Dragon
Viverna
Oregon (3/4 4 valve BBb)
Berg
Gnagey
Contra
French tuba
Imp (3/4 3 valve BBb)

Dolce
Duplex
Festivo


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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby UncleBeer » Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:55 pm

Doc wrote:
UncleBeer wrote:
Liberty Mo wrote:Just curious as to what other tubas Wessex will have at TMEA?


Kaiser
Chicago
Chicago "Presence"
Wyvern
Dragon
Viverna
Oregon (3/4 4 valve BBb)
Berg
Gnagey
Contra
French tuba
Imp (3/4 3 valve BBb)

Dolce
Duplex
Festivo


No Linz?


Oops. Add:

Linz
Prokofiev
Grand
new model euphonium
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby UncleBeer » Tue Feb 12, 2019 3:58 pm

Liberty Mo wrote:Just curious as to what other tubas Wessex will have at TMEA?


Chuck lives there.
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Wyvern » Tue Feb 12, 2019 5:24 pm

Mark Finley wrote:
UncleBeer wrote:
Liberty Mo wrote:Just curious as to what other tubas Wessex will have at TMEA?


Oregon (3/4 4 valve BBb)


ok, I'll bite. what's the significance of the name?

A tribute to Wessex genius tuba designer, Chuck Nickles! :wink:
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby toobagrowl » Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:54 pm

Doc wrote: The right mouthpiece helps (most big kaisers prefer deep bowls)


Wyvern wrote:The Wessex Kaiser will be supplied with the type of funnel mouthpiece that is popular with German players to use with large Kaiser tubas.


^ This just illustrates that everyone has different preferences, and mpc choice is very personal/individual. I personally prefer medium or medium-shallow bowl mpcs on my Kaiser BBb for now as least.

Wyvern wrote:A tribute to Wessex genius tuba designer, Chuck Nickles! :wink:


So, does Mr. Nickles prefer nickel or brass? Sorry, couldn't resist :lol: :tuba:
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Postby Wyvern » Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:40 pm

I would say a big thing with this tuba is not to overblow. The bell is so high above the players head that it is louder than they may perceive behind the mouthpiece. Play what feels to you as mf when the music is marked f, etc. Let the tuba work to produce big tone. If overblown the Kaiser could obliterate an orchestra, so hold back and only give more if the conductor asks.
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