Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by Three Valves »

That was a BAT alright!!
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by bort »

I'm sure the $20k pricetag on the Siegfried isnt helping its popularity. Not that it isnt worth it... but when your budget is $20k, that covers about 99% of all tubas. So the Siegfried had better be THE tuba for you.
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by Three Valves »

Why don’t tuba players get “sponsored” the way violin and cello players do?? Those guys don’t own their 500k axes!!
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by toobagrowl »

Not all Kaisers are the same. I have an old Kaiser BBb (prolly not as nice as Doc's) that has a very large .850" valve bore, a 20" bell with a very fat throat and about 41 or 42" tall. It has seen better days, but plays very well when the rotors are oiled and I use the right mpc. Kinda sounds like a Yorkbrunner; not as "direct" as some Kaisers, but still denser and more direct than the 6/4 York-a-phones. Other Kaisers are even "puffier" in sound than mine.
Just saying that due to their large typical 5/4+ ish size, they still have a lot of body to the sound and are not 'lazertone direct' :!:
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by Wyvern »

The Wessex Kaiser will be supplied with the type of funnel mouthpiece that is popular with German players to use with large Kaiser tubas. It is completely different to the 6/4 York tuba mouthpiece.

The unlacquered Kaiser we exhibited at DC is now with Mike Roylance to potentially use for Bruckner 9 performances with the Boston Symphony this next week. The Kaiser at TMEA will be a beautiful silver-plated example which has at last been found at Paris airport - and made its way over the Atlantic (together with new 3/4 BBb tuba).
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by Chris Mayer »

How does the Wessex compare to the Melton 197 or the original B&F ? Or in a bit more wider comparison with the likes of Alexander 164, Rudolf Meinl 5/4, Miraphone Hagen etc. ?

Would these other tubas even have a chance, as the Wessex, besides commercial advantages, is not only „based“ on legacy models but also an improved version and produced within an ever improving design, production and quality factory environment ? Why play the other oldfashioned and expensive stuff ?

As finally commercially and technically superior, remaining key challenge would only be to convince German tuba players to play chinese in their humba, symphonic or ensemble groups. (can be done, „made in germany“ has also finally worked out, maybe not as the British had initially intended...).

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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by Wyvern »

Chris Mayer wrote:How does the Wessex compare to the Melton 197 or the original B&F ? Or in a bit more wider comparison with the likes of Alexander 164, Rudolf Meinl 5/4, Miraphone Hagen etc. ?

Would these other tubas even have a chance, as the Wessex, besides commercial advantages, is not only „based“ on legacy models but also an improved version and produced within an ever improving design, production and quality factory environment ? Why play the other oldfashioned and expensive stuff ?

As finally commercially and technically superior, remaining key challenge would only be to convince German tuba players to play chinese in their humba, symphonic or ensemble groups. (can be done, „made in germany“ has also finally worked out, maybe not as the British had initially intended...).

Chris
Feedback received is the new Kaiser compares very favourable, but visit the Wessex booth at Frankfurt Musikmesse and judge for yourself. We are located next to Miraphone in the hall
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by Liberty Mo »

Wyvern wrote:The Wessex Kaiser will be supplied with the type of funnel mouthpiece that is popular with German players to use with large Kaiser tubas. It is completely different to the 6/4 York tuba mouthpiece.

The unlacquered Kaiser we exhibited at DC is now with Mike Roylance to potentially use for Bruckner 9 performances with the Boston Symphony this next week. The Kaiser at TMEA will be a beautiful silver-plated example which has at last been found at Paris airport - and made its way over the Atlantic (together with new 3/4 BBb tuba).
Just curious as to what other tubas Wessex will have at TMEA?
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by UDELBR »

Liberty Mo wrote: Just curious as to what other tubas Wessex will have at TMEA?
Kaiser
Chicago
Chicago "Presence"
Wyvern
Dragon
Viverna
Oregon (3/4 4 valve BBb)
Berg
Gnagey
Contra
French tuba
Imp (3/4 3 valve BBb)

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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by UDELBR »

Doc wrote:
UncleBeer wrote:
Liberty Mo wrote: Just curious as to what other tubas Wessex will have at TMEA?
Kaiser
Chicago
Chicago "Presence"
Wyvern
Dragon
Viverna
Oregon (3/4 4 valve BBb)
Berg
Gnagey
Contra
French tuba
Imp (3/4 3 valve BBb)

Dolce
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Festivo
No Linz?
Oops. Add:

Linz
Prokofiev
Grand
new model euphonium
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by UDELBR »

Liberty Mo wrote: Just curious as to what other tubas Wessex will have at TMEA?
Chuck lives there.
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by Wyvern »

Mark Finley wrote:
UncleBeer wrote:
Liberty Mo wrote: Just curious as to what other tubas Wessex will have at TMEA?
Oregon (3/4 4 valve BBb)
ok, I'll bite. what's the significance of the name?
A tribute to Wessex genius tuba designer, Chuck Nickles! :wink:
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by toobagrowl »

Doc wrote: The right mouthpiece helps (most big kaisers prefer deep bowls)
Wyvern wrote:The Wessex Kaiser will be supplied with the type of funnel mouthpiece that is popular with German players to use with large Kaiser tubas.
^ This just illustrates that everyone has different preferences, and mpc choice is very personal/individual. I personally prefer medium or medium-shallow bowl mpcs on my Kaiser BBb for now as least.
Wyvern wrote: A tribute to Wessex genius tuba designer, Chuck Nickles! :wink:
So, does Mr. Nickles prefer nickel or brass? Sorry, couldn't resist :lol: :tuba:
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by Wyvern »

I would say a big thing with this tuba is not to overblow. The bell is so high above the players head that it is louder than they may perceive behind the mouthpiece. Play what feels to you as mf when the music is marked f, etc. Let the tuba work to produce big tone. If overblown the Kaiser could obliterate an orchestra, so hold back and only give more if the conductor asks.
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by Chris Mayer »

Bloke,

sorry for the delayed response.

Have owned an Alex 164 and also 163 for years. Took me some work and a while to „control“ the instruments - vs a pick and play other brands. Have used a borrowed Rudy 5/4 pre Bayreuth in several concerts but went for the Alex 164 due to costs and air management. Play tested the 197/2 of a friend and found that the instrument has a little more projection and „bite“ than the Alex 164 but was told that the 197, as the Alex 164 needs constant training (both are these kind of instruments were you even after a few days of not playing them, even having played other tubas, feel the difference, but if you did, what a sound...). Have also play tested 2 Fafner 195/2 vs my Alexander 163 and witnessed Bob Tucci playing them (one his own 195/2, was also allowed to play text his Rudy BB 5/4 and his Hirsbrunner once, and know also a Yorkbrunner, at least for 45 mins, who belonged to Mr. Monch, Basel, thanks Tim, which I also liked a lot ).

Despite of stating the obvious that they are all being a little bit different, the special quality of all these instruments (sound, resonance, speak) boils down to the fact, that they are handmade, which in essence is the use of thin / thinner brass sheets vs the industrial/hydraulic versions in all parts, cutting from sheets for constant and thin wall sections, constant annealing and work hardening the metall by the traditional forming and bending processes (lead, pitch, zerobend....).... If you compare eg a 195 vs a handmade 195/2 the difference becomes obvious. An Alexander weights just about 9 kg and once you touch it first it feels suprisingly light and not as heavy as the size would imply.

Final key to a high quality instrument is the mechanics which has partially improved a lot especially on rotories.

I wish Jonathan and his team (hi chuck) all the best for the Kaiser and in preserving the heritage and legacy of such great instruments (form, warp bore and taper) but obviously also with the right production technics (substance and resonator).

regards

Christoph
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by MikeMason »

How are the valves/linkages? Chinese or German?
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by MikeMason »

I seem to recall a German valve option for an up charge. Just curious.
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by Kdtuba »

At Midwest I was able to play the Prototype (finished prototype?) Of this tuba and it is awesome. Ease of playing, depth of sound (the "blow and it plays loud"), and response of the valves are great. I'm used to playing on an HB6 so maybe it's just the difference intonation, but the intonation on this Kaiser is pretty dang good.
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by Chris Mayer »

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VoY2TN6FKVU" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank

really leapfrogging tuba advertisement !

Austro-hungarian/sudetendeutsches Design
German valves
German brass
Chinese Craftsmenship
American tech consultancy
British initiation and marketing

Is this tuba a threat to the National Security of the United States ?

:twisted: sorry couldn‘t resist

Chris
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Re: Jonathan's Kaiser BBb

Post by toobagrowl »

Doc wrote: Easy response, easy intonation (unlike the 197), and played flawlessly. Kaiser tubas are different beasts than York style tubas and even other large BBb tubas. Comparing it to a Fafner or 164 is not an even comparison. The kaiser makes a Fafner look like a pup. The sound is really something to behold if you don’t try to hoss it. I’d play one any day.
^ This has been repeated by some on here about the M-W 197. But every time I see/hear video of the 197, it sounds great and there is just moderate 1st slide pumping. Compare that to 6/4 York-style tubas where you see tooba players pulling & pushing at least a couple slides more than several inches each.....

I do not have the luxury/opportunity to "hog up" and play & spit into every tuba in the room at these conventions like some of you. But have you guys actually played the real-deal 197, or are you just going on hearsay? Wanna know :idea:
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