Old King Euph

[LibraryMark]

So I am looking for a horn to play along with my wife, who is learning to play euphonium. We bought her a nice King 2280 and I need a horn that does not need to be wonderful but serviceable. Found this one on ebay:

old_king_resized.jpg

Currently it's not too expensive. Does anyone know what I might expect from this horn?

[LibraryMark]

There was Euph Scefing, scourge of many tribes,
A wrecker of mead-benches, rampaging among foes.
This terror of the hall-troops had come far.
A foundling to start with, he would flourish later on
As his powers waxed and his worth was proved.
In the end each clan on the outlying coasts
Beyond the whale-road had to yield to him
And begin to pay tribute. That was one good king.

So you are saying this is a good horn?

[Worth]

This brings up the old question of the tuning slide before the valve block. I've read on earlier Tubenet posts that it is easier to adapt existing valve clusters to several different instruments if the tuning slide is between the leadpipe and valve cluster. I've noticed that many current Indian horns have this configuration, but also that many respected older horns like the Hirsbrunner HB390 as well as a beautiful horn on Lee Stofer's site that was recently sold, a Rudolf Meinl Perantucci Model CC per his web site a very close copy of a 1912 Conn Helleberg model piston CC. There has to be a reason that you don't see this design employed more often on modern horns except those coming out of India. I've always wondered about this and I know that there is higher knowledge here on Tubenet that can answer that question.

[LibraryMark]

My VMI 3302 has a slide on the leadpipe, but near as I can tell it's only to collect condensation. It's very handy as it collects most of the spit and is easy to empty quickly. I have never used it to tune with. I just want to know if anyone has ever played one like the one in the picture and what it was like.

[windshieldbug]

There has to be a reason that you don't see this design employed more often on modern horns except those coming out of India. I've always wondered about this

In the more soprano world it has to do with trumpets v. flugelhorns, and why "bore" at the valves does not mean the same thing between different horn wraps. A tuba gets bigger from the mouthpiece to the bell, and the valves can be placed almost anywhere (within reason) in between.

A tuba (or euphonium) with a narrow effective bore profile places the valve constriction further back in the profile so that the tubing leading up to it stays small and tends to stay smaller once exiting them.
A tuba (or euphonium) with a large bore profile places the valve constriction earlier in the profile so that the tubing leading up to it stays short and them widens more over it's longer travel to the bell.

The result is smaller, brighter sound vs. a broader, more flexible sound.
Of course, there are TONS of other components that enter into the tonality, but mouthpipe and wrap are one.

[2ba4t]

This is identical to my ultimate favourite instrument. It blows with a wonderful, sweet, old fashioned sound. Mine had not been used for decades so the valves were scarcely worn.

I understand that instruments with a tuning slide before the valves have a narrower [obviously much longer] mouthpipe, slower expansion and a more focussed, horn-like sound. The tuning slide after the valves models allow a much fatter main bugle, faster expansion and tubbier, flatter, mellow, 'saxhorn' sound. I sense a wide divide in sound between the Adolphe Sax (Wieprecht) bass saxhorns and the Cerveny style tubas. I would love to learn about the different bugle profiles of different instruments from mouthpipe to bell and the real difference it makes.

The ultimate book on the tuba, that everyone must buy and read at least 5 times, Dr Clifford Bevan's 'The Tuba Family', http://www.piccolopress.info/tuba_family.htm" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank £35 - $45 - deals with this of course, (pp189-190) but I would like to learn more.

[Do not buy this book online except direct online from Dr. Bevan himself. Never from the evil, despicable criminals selling this on XXXXX for over double and for other mad higher prices] The learned and esteemed author's press - Piccolo Press - sells them at a great price for a brilliantly-written and researched ultimate encyclopaedia. You get by return of post - in my experience.

Disclaimer - I have never spoken to, met nor have any connection or relationship financial or otherwise with Dr Bevan.

[Worth]

Thanks to Windshieldbug and 2ba4t for helping me to understand and especially to 2ba4t for Dr. Bevan's reference. Although it runs as a tangent to the OPs question, life is for learning (CSNY nod there). Aside from the inane and entertaining humor here on Tubenet, there is lots to be learned.