Buying an Eb tuba

[GC]

Eastman makes the EBE851 with a 15" bell. The 853 is the one with a 17" bell. They finally have a picture of an 853 up on their web site. https://www.eastmanwinds.com/ebe853

I heard a couple of years back that they were piloting a 3/4 size 3+1 compensator with a 15" bell, but I've heard no more about any 3+1 horns from them since.

[ken k]

I remember playing the Eastman Ebs at the Army conference about 3 or 4 years ago, and really liked them. But Eastman seems to have been very slow to release them and they are as rare as hen's teeth. No one carries them to try out that I know of.

kk

[Erik_Sweden]

What kind of playing will you be doing mostly?

Good luck in your quest and enjoy the journey!!!!

ken k

I play mostly in concert band (one with ~25 players and another with ~40, both has one Bb tuba).

/Erik

[Michael Grant]

I play a Willson 3400 and it works in pretty much any ensemble. I’ve used it in brass bands, brass ensembles (large and small), quartets, concert bands, solo work, jazz groups, etc. Intonation and response are great. Comfortable to hold. Solid horn.

I see there are 4 versions of the 3400 at their site. Wich version do you have?

I have the 3400 FA-5. Designed by Marty Erickson. I just checked out the website to see what other options they offered. When I bought it (2000 or 2001) I think it was the only option for a 3400. It came with the ME-1 tuba mouthpiece, designed by Marty for this horn and it has been a perfect fit. I’ve tried other mouthpieces but always come back to the ME-1.

[swanben11]

My thaught for the Eastman was a Ford Mustang. With automatic ... The Cavalry seems to be (like the Besson 983) a british style tuba in disguise (left hand drive!)

Given that the 983 and Eastman 853 share general bugle dimensions, bell diameter, and a compensating valve set, what would you say is the biggest differentiating factor between the two? You seem to have a very different perception of those two, superficially similar horns. I ask because the 853 seems like my dream horn, but I've only test driven the 983 at this point.

[Snake Charmer]

When I played the 983 (years ago when it was brand-new) my feeling was: just my 981 with different ergonomics and left-facing bell. The Besson and the Eastman may look the same but differ in style. The Bessons play always Beautiful (with capital B!), the Eastman offers more edge.

[swanben11]

When I played the 983 (years ago when it was brand-new) my feeling was: just my 981 with different ergonomics and left-facing bell. The Besson and the Eastman may look the same but differ in style. The Bessons play always Beautiful (with capital B!), the Eastman offers more edge.

Interesting. And have you found that translates to a clearer, more powerful low register? By the way, I can’t thank you enough for how much you’ve already shared about this horn between two forums. Given how difficult it is to try a horn right now, I’ve found your input to be absolutely indispensable.

[Snake Charmer]

Directly compared the I can play the Eastman much louder than the Besson (981), specially in the low register. In a group the smaller bell will help, too, but I played a solo on both horns in a small church. With the Besson it was impressive for the audience. Two years later with the Eastman (owned just for two months) I made no sound check in advance because I knew the church and the audience started to appear. This time I scared the audience to death... I didn't realize how much more punch the horn offers! But it is still a compensated horn, so from Gb to E is a bit more work and you need more effort and air on all 4th valve notes. The Gnagey can probably offer a more open sound low down.

[barry grrr-ero]

3+1 compensating Eb tubas are vastly more versatile than many people will lead you to believe. In England, those players still use them for all kinds of work, not just brass bands. I think they give a lot of bang for the buck. Sure, if you want to peel paint off the walls with your low register, don't get one of these. That said, I once heard the tuba player of the Royal Philharmonic play Mahler 5 on his Fletcher style 3+1 Eb tuba (19" bell and larger leadpipe). It wasn't the sound I'd choose for that piece, but he did just fine!

If you go on Youtube and listen to some of the guys playing the Gnagey Eb, you'll hear that it has a lot of that same 'singing' quality in the upper register that the 3+1 Eb tubas possess. However, the Gnagey will also give you a stronger low register. You would, however, have to deal with the 5 valve system on a tuba that's already in 3 flats. If I bought a Gnagey - which I might - I would have a 5th valve slide made up to sound the low tritone B-natural. That would greatly simplify low end fingerings (while perhaps making 'fine tuning' a tad more challenging in the process).

I think Tony Clements has given very good advice. If you're anywhere near the Wessex showroom, you should go there and toot some of their Eb tubas, including the Gnagey; Wessex's own copies of 3+1 British style Eb tubas, and their 4 valve compensating inline model - similar to the 983 (the Eastman Eb is similar to that too).

I briefly owned a Willson 3400 and absolutely hated it. For me, it was an ergonomic disaster. In addition, all three registers (low, middle and high) had a completely different timbre, as well as their own, unique tuning quirks. Maybe it was just a bad example, but I just couldn't make it work for anything. For me, it was like owning an ergonomically bad 3/4 CC with vastly heavier valves. I will divulge that my used 3400 did not come with the prescribed ME mouthpiece. I tried all kinds of other ones on it instead. I later traded it for a 983 and couldn't have been happier (however, I do prefer the valve layout of the 3+1 tubas).

[swanben11]

Directly compared the I can play the Eastman much louder than the Besson (981), specially in the low register. In a group the smaller bell will help, too, but I played a solo on both horns in a small church. With the Besson it was impressive for the audience. Two years later with the Eastman (owned just for two months) I made no sound check in advance because I knew the church and the audience started to appear. This time I scared the audience to death... I didn't realize how much more punch the horn offers! But it is still a compensated horn, so from Gb to E is a bit more work and you need more effort and air on all 4th valve notes. The Gnagey can probably offer a more open sound low down.

I like 17” bells on general purpose horns. 19” is pretty on an Eb, but it’s pretty whether you want it to be or not. Not the most obvious solution for a ‘do it all” horn. Especially since my first tuba HAS to do everything. My first time playing an Eb (having learned on BBb) I was really shocked at just how clear and navigable the pedal register was (this held true on other horns as well,) and my thought is that as long as that “stuffy zone” is just that tight cluster right before the fundamental, it’s not significantly worse than a non compensator with all the valves down. Every horn has a dead zone. I’ve heard this horn in recordings, and it really sounds vibrant and colorful to me in a way that most compensators just don’t. Hopefully I get to play one soon. Fingers crossed. If it all lines up for me, I REALLY like the idea of a rotor less horn too. Pistons are so easy to disassemble and clean, and I’m a fan of low maintenance in general. That’s one reason I wasn’t chomping at the bit to purchase a Gnagey. That and the freakishly uncomfortable valve angle. If the Eastman plays and sounds anything similar to that horn, I’m more than likely buying it.

[Dan Tuba]

I purchased a new Besson International 782 3+1 Compensating EEb. It plays well, has excellent valves/slides and it was relatively inexpensive compared to the 982. I have access to a Besson 982 at work, but to my surprise, the 782 is nearly as good. Here's a video from one of my practice sessions.

https://youtu.be/9YYt38r-H-U

I don't play EEb tubas very often, since I mainly play/perform with large ensembles. I purchased this tuba as a "nice to have, if needed." Good luck on your search.