Moving/swaying while playing...

[Carroll]

Have we not all seen performances where a "wiggle worm" so distracted from his own performance that you left and could not really remember HOW he played, only that he sure moved around A LOT? How many times have you left a performance and thought "wow, they sounded great... I just wish they had wiggled more?"

O.K. sometimes... but only if there were a chance of décolleté spillage.

[funkcicle]

Seems simple enough to me... any kind of movement that requires or invokes <i>any</i> amount of conscious contemplation, discussion, or retrospection is superfluous.

[BopEuph]

I used to move quite a bit. I used to play cello, where I was taught to move with the bow. Not to get into the music, but to flow with my bow. I may have gotten a little more excited than I should have. It transferred to euphonium. When I was in high school, a few of the other euphonium students (including one at the local college) thought that's where I pulled some of my ability from, so they started emulating me. That actually got annoying. When I got to college, friends would tell me that they were getting seasick watching me at concerts. It was something that was very subconcious for me. My teacher, Paul Ebbers, pointed out that it was bad for keeping air inside. It's hard breaking that habit. Steve Mead in a lesson lectured me about it. Eventually, my nickname became "Epilleptic Nick," because my friends joked that the movement might cause a seizure in epilleptics.

I'm still working on the whole moving thing. It is almost gone now, and I now don't understand how I played with it. I do play bass as well, and I do have a problem moving with that, too. But right now, I credit that to having a problem relaxing with the instrument. The moving on bass is getting smaller every day, but until I fix it, I am going to have a problem playing faster than 250.

All in all, it seems like a good idea, but go with Arnie's saying:

"Play by sound, not by feel."

Nick

[Rick F]

Hi Nick,

Were you by chance at ITEC in Greensboro, NC? I remember a eupher who played in Brian Bowman's master class who moved a quite a bit. He played well, but the movement was a bit distracting. If so, glad to hear you've got a handle on it. Makes sense that the excessive movement may have come from playing cello.

[BopEuph]

That would be me! Well, at least it makes for a memorable performance. Epileptic Nick is no more (well, maybe as a bass player for the moment, but that is changing, too).

Nick the Ex Epileptic

[Rick F]

That would be me! Well, at least it makes for a memorable performance.

That's okay. Glad you're doing well.

[SqueakyOnion]

So Nick (the ex-epileptic, or anyone else who would like to respond), did you move ALL THE TIME when you played, during technical and melodic parts?

After watching myself in a mirror, my bell only actually moves, at most, 4 or 5 inches, usually just an inch or two. The only other thing I noticed was that my shoulders tend to rise and fall ever so slightly with the music. Would doing this really constrict my air? As we all know, air is very precious to a WIND player...

Should I try to remain totally still when playing?

When I play remaining totally still, I feel almost inhibited from make the music more expressive.

I guess I really just want to know what the negative effects, if any, my movement has on my playing?

[MaryAnn]

Ever heard the term "bobbing bassoonist?"

And on horn playing....most hornists who play "on the leg" will be more or less motionless while playing. That was one thing I found in common between horn playing and bluegrass playing...the motionless aspect. At least in authentic bluegrass playing. One of the show aspects of authentic bluegrass playing is to play one zillion notes per second while appearing to not move at all.

So....for bluegrass fiddle and horn, I be motionless as possible. For "show" bluegrass and "show" violin, the flourishes are present.

On tuba....our brass band gives free concerts at places like retirement communities; I have been known to purposely sway the tuba back and forth with the beat, for the benefit of the audience. Gives them something to look at.

Once after an orchestra concert a guy came up on stage and asked about the "steering wheel" horn emptying that is necessary with my horn. He asked what it was for; my answer was to give the audience something to look at, before I told him what it was really for. Since then I try to keep a lower profile with my emptying. Except when we did Musical Joke; for that one....I did extremely exaggerated emptying, and a few choice other things, during the tacet movement. Do you know how funny the audience thinks it is when one of the horn players can perfectly mimic the first violinist? With attendant snotty facial expressions? I'm not saying I actually did that.

MA

[BopEuph]

So Nick (the ex-epileptic, or anyone else who would like to respond), did you move ALL THE TIME when you played, during technical and melodic parts?

I'm not sure when I actually did it or not; like I said, it was more or less subconcious. All I knew of it was what people were telling me after my performances.

After watching myself in a mirror, my bell only actually moves, at most, 4 or 5 inches, usually just an inch or two. The only other thing I noticed was that my shoulders tend to rise and fall ever so slightly with the music. Would doing this really constrict my air? As we all know, air is very precious to a WIND player...

I'm told that most people can get away with moving a little, but especially in my case, being around 6'5''+, everything gets a little more magnified. Shoulders rising and falling is a problem with air, and if nothing else, causes tension. It seems to be the trademark of jazz saxophone players, where the most famous of the idiom are trying to kill that stereotype (were you ever a sax player?).

Should I try to remain totally still when playing?

You don't have to be COMPLETELY still, but practicing thinking about being still will be a good excercise. It's like practicing taking the largest breaths you can take, but in performance, you probably don't want to spend the time during rests doing that. The practice just helps you take larger breaths naturally.

When I play remaining totally still, I feel almost inhibited from make the music more expressive.

The ability to move/not move should have no effect on your ability to express your music. Music is sound; not sight. Sure, it makes people THINK you know what you're doing, until the visual is taken away. Like I quoted before, "Play by SOUND, not by FEEL." That's what Prof. Ebbers stressed to me many times. If you want to move to the music, take up dancing.

I guess I really just want to know what the negative effects, if any, my movement has on my playing?

There can be many. Moving keeps your chops from being still on the mouthpiece, which can cause leaks, shifting embouchures, etc. It can cause problems with air. It can also cause tension, which will also affect your air intake. You ever notice how most trumpet players keep their right pinkie out of the ring next to the valves? Sure, some people do it, but it's a good idea not to due to the lack of independent digits. Or like puffing your cheeks. Bottom line, just don't do it.

Nick

[SqueakyOnion]

"SqueakyOnion wrote:
When I play remaining totally still, I feel almost inhibited from make the music more expressive.


The ability to move/not move should have no effect on your ability to express your music. Music is sound; not sight. Sure, it makes people THINK you know what you're doing, until the visual is taken away. Like I quoted before, "Play by SOUND, not by FEEL." That's what Prof. Ebbers stressed to me many times. If you want to move to the music, take up dancing. "


Well whether it should or not, it does. For myself, music is often an all-engaging activity. It's not only in my head. My mind is not separate from my body, my body is my mind, a part of it. There is no "mind controlling the body." It just all mind...I know that's not very clearly explained. But since my mind is engaged, my body has to be as well.

I may only be 18 (in a week ), but with all due respect, I think I'm tending to disagree with you on a "no-movement" idea, except for certain instances where the environment calls for complete stillness.

Also, how is raising my shoulders a problem with my air? My shoulders raise generally at the tops of phrases in expressive parts, not for breaths or anything of the sort?

My movement does not cause my embouchure to shift or leak, it's not nearly that much movement.

I really don't mean to sound arrogant, and am not trying to argue, and I have a feeling you're thinking I move more than I usually do...though maybe not. In any case, thank you for the responses.

[Mark]

Also, how is raising my shoulders a problem with my air?

Go to a Pat Sheridan masterclass and try raising your shoulders...