Video Review of Dillon Music cimbasso (Jinbao).

[Rivercity Tuba]

I am baffled by the comments from the TNJ. The demonstration, playing quality are all top notch. Chris demonstrated effectively what these instruments can do at a VERY high level. Thank him for his time and efforts, I for one appreciate them. For whatever it is worth, I make my living playing the tuba in a symphony orchestra.

[MackBrass]

I am baffled by the comments from the TNJ. The demonstration, playing quality are all top notch. Chris demonstrated effectively what these instruments can do at a VERY high level. Thank him for his time and efforts, I for one appreciate them. For whatever it is worth, I make my living playing the tuba in a symphony orchestra.

+1
I would love to hear those that claim to hear the grass grow put themselves out on YouTube. Unless you have done a pro audition and have at least advanced for something, you probably don't know what sounds good from the bad. Chris did a great demo and did the horn true justice as it deserves. Hats off to him as I will be doing one in the near future with my 200 dollars of recording equipment.

JMHO

[emcallaway]

We're all adults and sometimes even friends here. The world will be a better place if we focus our energies on making better music instead of nitpicking at each other.

I think that Mr. Olka did a fine review of the instrument and sounded great on it. I think that almost here can agree that he's a fantastic player and a very positive contributor to the tuba player community. In fact, following the related videos from his review landed me in his "Drill of the Week" series, which has given my practicing a bit more focus this week. Thanks, Chris!

[MackBrass]

Unless you have done a pro audition and have at least advanced for something, you probably don't know what sounds good from the bad.

That is perhaps the most insulting comment I've ever read on this board. Seriously. If you haven't won or advanced in an audition, you don't know good from bad? Get off your **** high horse already.

(edit for afterthought)

Who here HAS taken (and advanced) at a Cimbasso audition? Ehhh? Speak up.

I am not going to start anything with you but please don't miss quote me. Please read what I wrote as I said you probably dont know what sounds good from the bad. . This is a sad reality but very true. Sure I could have worded it differently but I certainly didn't mean it as an insult to anyone. My apologies if I offended anyone.

Tom

[DaTweeka]

I'd like to make it clear that I wasn't slamming Mr. Olka's playing, or the horn itself. It was asked if I thought it was a good sound, and I gave an honest opinion. Compared to the cimbasso in MY head, that horn just sounds a bit too tuba-like for my taste. I don't pretend to be all-knowing, but Donn openly asked for opinions on the sound of the horn, and I gave mine. I like the sound he gets (as stated above), but it's not THE sound I want. I don't expect anyone to play with that sound but myself, and once I have the means to get an ax of this type ( and have put in some good face time with it), I'll be more than happy to put up some videos on YouTube.

[bisontuba]

Hi-
The JinBao made Cimbasso clone is a great horn at an unbelievable price. However, it IS extremely mouthpiece sensitive. If you are going to ITEC and are going to play test one, make sure you try various mouthpieces with the horn--

Mark 'sure enjoying mine'....

[bisontuba]

What does "mouthpiece sensitive" mean?

Should I be using something besides a Conn "Chief" with mine...??

How about a 12C ?

Maybe a Dr. Young on it...

[MartyNeilan]

I think a lot of it comes down to this: most of us have no idea what a cimbasso is supposed to sound like. We know Bobo on the 184, Jake on the York, Fletch on the EEb. Who are our cimbasso idols?
A couple years ago a talented musician released a very well done CD featuring the cimbasso. It was top notch, but I found the sound slightly plain. It had neither the growl and grit of a commercial bass trombone nor the weight and girth of a tuba. It was very, very good vanilla to my ears. As we are still trying to figure out what physically constitutes a cimbasso, so also are we figuring out what should come out of the bell. Perhaps it might be safe to say there is no right or wrong this early in the game, as long as it is in time and in tune.

[The Big Ben]

I remember that I asked about the sound of a cimbasso a couple of years ago and there were not many examples on YouTube. Mattis Cederberg was one of them.

I've seen more than a few pictures of Tommy Johnson holding a cimbasso in a session. Maybe the sound could be dug out of some of his film work.

[Wyvern]

A cimbasso is really a valved contrabass trombone, so it should sound like a trombone

[Eric Fritz]

Anybody have a chance to try the Dillon with a Wessex. About the same price and look very similar. Same axe?

[Untersatz]

I'm NOT knocking Chris's playing at all & I do realize that the recording equipment used was less than ideal, but that cimbasso
sounded almost painfully bright to me
I also realize that it is NOT a clone of a $15K Haag cimbasso either but I was wondering if this Chinese made horn can sound even remotely like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSb-_RXcI1g" target="_blank

[Bob Kolada]

I realize most of you weren't on the bass trombone forum and his concept may have well changed, but Mattis said when he was looking for a cimbasso that he wanted more of a nimble tuba sound.
IMO, Chris sounds a lot like an F contrabass trombone. I don't get all the fussing...
Personally, I'd just get the F contrabone; I'm a valve guy at heart but few valved trombones really have that full on trombone sound. Also, it's a lot cheaper and if you think the horn in question cranks... hell hath no fury like a contrabass trombone unleashed.

[pgym]

I'm NOT knocking Chris's playing at all & I do realize that the recording equipment used was less than ideal, but that cimbasso
sounded almost painfully bright to me
I also realize that it is NOT a clone of a $15K Haag cimbasso either but I was wondering if this Chinese made horn can sound even remotely like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSb-_RXcI1g" target="_blank" target="_blank

Given that one can make a bass trombone--or ANY brass instrument, for that matter--can be made to sound dark and mellow or bright and cutting, and every shade in between, depending on the player's approach to playing it, I would wager that the sound coming out of the bell of ANY cimbasso is largely a function of how the player is playing it as opposed to its country of manufacture.

[MartyNeilan]

Does it really matter what it sounds like? Why not be creative for once and play the sound that you like instead of sounding like someone else? This goes for tuba as well. It seems that too many people strive for a sound that is similar to certain players but don't just find their own sound. I realize that certain situations call for certain sounds and a job could depend on what you sound like but I venture to guess that most people on this board are not going to be auditioning on contra bass valve trombone anytime soon. Find your sound and go with it. If you don't like Chris's sound, find your own preference. The guy has a job in a major symphony for a reason.

Casca "thinks too many people are concerned about sounding more like Jake, Fletch, Bobo, Bell, etc...and are less concerned about what kind of great sound they can make on their own" Grossa.

I would normally agree with you (I still do in theory), but based on some recordings uploaded by high school students looking only for positive affirmation, I think there needs to be constructive examples for them and others to follow. Those examples can be used as a guide, and then an individual's sound developed after that. When completely left to their own devices, many students will develop a thin sound that is very blatty and with few of the lower overtones or fundamental that define a true bass or contrabass sound.

[Donn]

I can't see how anyone who plays a musical instrument could agree with that, honestly. Listening to great sounds that other people make on an instrument is a huge part of getting your own sound. So someone says "I like this here sound, does it seem like this is a suitable instrument for it?" -- and gets a flurry of posts trying to invalidate that question? What's going on here? That's a perfectly reasonable question.

[quesonegro]

What are you guys complaining about? I think Chris sounds great, fat and centered (the mic obviously can't do it justice)! I'm surprised that it holds together this well even at the strong dynamics! What a great thing, to take the time to make a nice video regarding a topic that so many are curious about!! As far as "mouthpiece sensitivity" goes, I second that, it took me a long time to find a mp that gave me what I wanted, essentially a big contra bone mp with a deeper cup, kinda But then, I'm a bass trombone player, not a tubaist...anyways, hats off to Chris! (Although I'm not going to trade in my Haag any time soon!)
As far a Jinbao cimbassi go, I haven't played one, so I can't say In the end, if you make it sound the way you want it to, that's it, no? If it can't do that, even a low price as far as cimbassi go, is a lot of money!

//Mattis

[toobagrowl]

I'm NOT knocking Chris's playing at all & I do realize that the recording equipment used was less than ideal, but that cimbasso
sounded almost painfully bright to me
I also realize that it is NOT a clone of a $15K Haag cimbasso either but I was wondering if this Chinese made horn can sound even remotely like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSb-_RXcI1g" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank

Different player, different horn, different mpc, different recording equipment, different acoustical environment, etc. Just sayin...

I realize most of you weren't on the bass trombone forum and his concept may have well changed, but Mattis said when he was looking for a cimbasso that he wanted more of a nimble tuba sound.
IMO, Chris sounds a lot like an F contrabass trombone. I don't get all the fussing...

Does it really matter what it sounds like? Why not be creative for once and play the sound that you like instead of sounding like someone else? This goes for tuba as well. It seems that too many people strive for a sound that is similar to certain players but don't just find their own sound. I realize that certain situations call for certain sounds and a job could depend on what you sound like but I venture to guess that most people on this board are not going to be auditioning on contra bass valve trombone anytime soon. Find your sound and go with it. If you don't like Chris's sound, find your own preference. The guy has a job in a major symphony for a reason.

Casca "thinks too many people are concerned about sounding more like Jake, Fletch, Bobo, Bell, etc...and are less concerned about what kind of great sound they can make on their own" Grossa.

What are you guys complaining about? I think Chris sounds great, fat and centered (the mic obviously can't do it justice)! I'm surprised that it holds together this well even at the strong dynamics! What a great thing, to take the time to make a nice video regarding a topic that so many are curious about!! As far as "mouthpiece sensitivity" goes, I second that, it took me a long time to find a mp that gave me what I wanted, essentially a big contra bone mp with a deeper cup, kinda But then, I'm a bass trombone player, not a tubaist...anyways, hats off to Chris! (Although I'm not going to trade in my Haag any time soon!)
As far a Jinbao cimbassi go, I haven't played one, so I can't say In the end, if you make it sound the way you want it to, that's it, no? If it can't do that, even a low price as far as cimbassi go, is a lot of money!

//Mattis

+1

[tubalooney]

Well said Mattis! I thought Chris's review excellent and working in an opera house, where the tuba player uses an Haag cimbasso, that sort of sound would be perfect for Scarpia's theme, just the right menace necessary. In Verdi it would sound great too! Let's not be too fussy about the whole vexed subject of cimbassi. Just try and imagine what Verdi and most tuba/trombone players had to put up with when this music was written. This was primarily an instrument used by town bands at the time and was part of the emotional soundscape of Verdi's Italy. By that I mean small bands playing at weddings, funerals and all sorts of parties and military occasions. Think the Godfather wedding scene in Italy as a sort of aural cue. I know before anyone points it out that there isn't a cimbasso in that scene it's just a well known filmic moment to give you idea. In many of Verdi's operas there is an offstage 'Banda' which is playing during some sort of party, La Traviata for example, precisely the sort of small party band that was in Verdi's musical experience. To play a tuba in this instance sounds just plain wrong... The cimbasso is perfect. In the orchestra for Verdi a tuba sounds wrong too. Rhythmic punch, articulation, clarity of sound and blend are paramount, think the introduction to "Va pensiero" with its punchy introduction and then it has to blend with the pianissimo singing of the chorus on its own.. a tuba just doesn't sound right. Anyway I'm pretty sure any of Verdi's cimbassist's would have given their left arm for something like this jinbao clone. In the end it's a pretty cool instrument and nowadays absolutely essential if you won't to be flexible in Europe. By the way Wessex tubas have just brought out an ophicleide and that's a whole other can of worms! Just the thoughts of a tuba playing opera singer with twenty five years experience in singing professionally in European opera houses. Cheers Phillip