Stars and Stripes

Chuck Jackson · Post by **Chuck Jackson** » Tue Feb 21, 2006 9:23 am

Alas, I played it by my lonesome. My director at the time was the one buying the beer.

Chuck

Arkietuba · Post by **Arkietuba** » Tue Feb 21, 2006 2:08 pm

I've heard that when Sousa performed his marches that the tempo was around 130-134 bpm.

Lew · Post by **Lew** » Tue Feb 21, 2006 2:43 pm

Arkietuba wrote:I've heard that when Sousa performed his marches that the tempo was around 130-134 bpm.

130 sounds more like a Karl King tempo. I think Sousa was more like 110-120.

Arkietuba · Post by **Arkietuba** » Tue Feb 21, 2006 6:46 pm

Lew wrote:
Arkietuba wrote:I've heard that when Sousa performed his marches that the tempo was around 130-134 bpm.
130 sounds more like a Karl King tempo. I think Sousa was more like 110-120.

I know that's what was notated on the music but I believe Sousa PERFORMED his marches at around 130...at least that is what I was told by a very famous composer/conductor (Stephen Mellilo)

8vabasso · Post by **8vabasso** » Tue Feb 21, 2006 7:08 pm

Check this out.
http://www.ita-web.org/festival/itf2002 ... ones01.wmv

Chuck(G) · Post by **Chuck(G)** » Tue Feb 21, 2006 7:29 pm

Arkietuba wrote:I know that's what was notated on the music but I believe Sousa PERFORMED his marches at around 130...at least that is what I was told by a very famous composer/conductor (Stephen Mellilo)

Offhand, I'd say that Sousa conducted marches somewhere between 68 and 220 bpm.

If I were ever to depend on someone's word abuot Sousa tempi, it'd be Keith Brion's, who has made a career of Sousa's music.

But we don't have to take anyone's word. Get a copy of Delos DE 3102 "All American Sousa". It contains recordings of 7 marches conducted by Sousa himself. One (S&S) is from a radio broadcast in 1929, two years before Sousa died. The remainder are acoustic recordings made between 1916 and 1923. The 1929 broadcast of Stars and Stripes is around 124 (as contrasted with the 1901 version at 118). The remainder vary between about 116-120. Is it reasonable to think that Sousa conducted at different tempi? Why not?

But 130 sounds excessive unless it's Sousa on drugs.

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Tue Feb 21, 2006 7:42 pm

I would imagine that the earlier recordings conducted by Pryor wouldn't be too far off, either. The band played them then all the time...

Albertibass · Post by **Albertibass** » Tue Feb 21, 2006 8:24 pm

Will wrote:Ask for a copy of the piccolo part and try it. Now that's fun!

yeah this year at all county band i tried to pull it out on the conducter....he was a traditional conducter and didnt want to have a tuba play the solo.

But hey it was worth a try

BVD Press · Post by **BVD Press** » Tue Feb 21, 2006 9:06 pm

Chuck(G) wrote: This isn't with Sousa directing--somewhere I've got one of Keith Brion's New Sousa Band CDs with a 1929 performance of the same with Sousa conducting; I'll check it out, but I don't think it was 124 either.

If you have a recording with Sousa conducting, it would be extremely rare. Having spent a few years doing research with researcher Paul Bierley, he mentioned many times that it wasn't really Sousa conducting. I cannot rememebr why that was, but it was.

iiipopes · Post by **iiipopes** » Tue Feb 21, 2006 10:32 pm

Sousa hated recording. He thought recording technology would be a passing fad, or of limited use, and noone would replace a live concert with a recording. So most of the band's recording sessions he turned over to Arthur Pryor, who thought recording technology was the thing of the future.

Chuck(G) · Post by **Chuck(G)** » Tue Feb 21, 2006 11:53 pm

BVD Press wrote:If you have a recording with Sousa conducting, it would be extremely rare. Having spent a few years doing research with researcher Paul Bierley, he mentioned many times that it wasn't really Sousa conducting. I cannot rememebr why that was, but it was.

There was the 1929 radio broadcast and the 3 Edison discs. That's the full extent of Sousa's recorded rep, according to Brion. There were many "Sousa Band" recordings of various composition and direction, but only those 4 discs by the man himself. The 1929 one has a spoken address by Sousa on one side.

NickJones · Post by **NickJones** » Wed Feb 22, 2006 6:01 am

Jonathantuba wrote:Well, I have now managed to get hold of the piccolo part!

Now all I need to do is learn to play it and persuade the conductor to let me - I think the latter may be the more difficult

The Fine Arts Brass series , have Stars and Stripes as a quintet with the picc line written as the tuba part ( in the trio section) , going back to different tempos for US Marches , we have played a few alexander , Kark King , JJ Richards , Sousa etc

Melody Shop - tempo around 120
Barnum and BailiesFavourite , Belfords Carnival , The Waltonian , Midwest - tempo from 160 - 180
Belle of Chicago , Washington Post , Liberty Bell , Sempre Fi - around 110-120
the only exception to the rule is we played the Thunderer always at 160+