Playing a piston tuba

[jonesbrass]

It's the reason so many people buy rotor F's even though all of them (save the firebird and the ones that are so big they sound like C's) have bad ranges in the Bb-D area just below the staff (more specifically that C though).

Nothing like sweeping generalizations there. I own a rotary F that outplays most CC's in the particular range you mentioned, and it isn't large at all. Of course, YMMV.

[Mark]

Rick "I'll take mine with tarter sauce" Denney

I think it's best to avoid acid reflux. Double-bagged and in the trash can is where it goes.

[Rick Denney]

Rick "I'll take mine with tarter sauce" Denney

I think it's best to avoid acid reflux. Double-bagged and in the trash can is where it goes.

Yeah, you're right. Some bottom feeders just aren't good eating.

Rick "who wouldn't want to taste that twice" Denney

[Tubaguy56]

sorry, I though it would go without saying that a rotor F with a good low range and not so big as to sound like a C would be an EXCEPTION to the rule, next time I'll be sure to include "except for the much less common horn". My fault on the wording, didn't mean it like that. if you spend enough time on TN you'd think you'd remember not to make broad generalizations....

[windshieldbug]

if you spend enough time on TN you'd think you'd remember not to make broad generalizations...

Espescially broad generalizations like that... !

[MaryAnn]

THUNK!

That was the sound of the TNFJ getting revved up.

To the guy who said that pistons slur better:

Well....one of the problems I have encountered when playing a (french) horn that is not my usual one, is that in order to have the slurs work as well as I (a string player) like them to work, I have to be very careful of the (new) timing of the valve stroke. I have to adjust the change in my chops very well in time with when the valve bottoms out on the note I'm slurring to. That of course is not a factor when playing tongued notes. If someone is not aware of this need for timing, or uses "piston timing," then the slurs ain't gonna work.

Can't think of a new thread, bloke, so I'll just bump this one. Giggle away. I figured all I'd get is a troll warning about trying to start a piston vs rotor discussion. Turned into a bottom feeder discussion, that included bassoons, British cigarettes, and bundles of wood, no less.

MA

[Tubaguy56]

I said pistons slur better (given that you are not playing BAD pistons, and GOOD rotors--->I would hope that would be obvious, but some people like to pick on generalizations

I also am aware of the timing difference

I'm actually playing a rotor F now, not by my own choice, but I am displeased with how much I have to think about the timing as opposed to piston F tubas that I have played. many of you will notice that my C, the horn that came before the F, is piston and may say that I've become so accustomed to playing pistons that I have to consciously think about timing on the F. However, before that I had a Miraphone 186 which had rotors.

My bottom line, I've never played rotors of a comparable quality to their piston counterpart in which I liked the slurring action better. This is a completely opiniated statement, as we've seen in this thread everybody feels differently about this.

Bo "really hopes he didn't make a generalization and not catch it" Atlas

[WakinAZ]

Back to MA's original observation about ergonomics and piston valves - there are pistons and then there are PISTONS. The M-W/B&S "big piston" sets that are on a lot of horns these days did not agree with my hands (long but only average width hands for a guy), but the smaller set on my old model King doesn't bother me at all. My Conn sousa also was fine. I also have less of a spread to maintain consistently with only 3 vs. 4 valves (pinky/little finger gets to rest).

The small set on my Olds is fine for my fingers but is at an awkward angle for my arm and elbow: the angle, array and position (relative to the rest of the horn) of the valve cluster can make a big difference.

As far as the technique debate, good players can adjust to either kind of valve and sound fine in both slurred and staccato/fast passages.

Eric "old school/smaller pistons for now, but more comfortable on rotaries" L.

[josh_kaprun]

I've also noticed the difference between different brands of pistons. When I was at TMEA last year, I spent about 2 hours playing on various Eb horns and found that there were some that I just could not play on comfortably. Specifically, I remember not liking the MW (I don't remember the model) because of the tubing that served as a thumb-ring thing, which caused the pistons to be at a very akward angle for me. My hand was hurting after playing a single scale. The B&S was better. I really liked the big sound, but the pistons sat a little too low for me to be comfortable with. The Willson 3400S, on the other hand, I found to be the perfect horn for me. Not only did I like the sound, but the pistons were at the perfect for my hand. So, as soon as I get the money, you can be sure that I will be getting one of those.

Now don't get me wrong here, I am NOT dissing any of the horns I mentioned not liking. I have heard people say that they find the Willsons to be akward and the MWs to be great...as I'm sure you will find people who will say the same about Miraphone, Yamaha, etc. My point is that you just have to find the right horn for you...and remember, it is ultimately the player, not the horn.

[tbn.al]

[/quote]you did feel it was important to call me something like that to my face, I would quite swiftly whop your damned ***. [/quote]

He would too! He ain't real big, but he's kind of stringy and downright mean when disturbed.

[SplatterTone]

Without a doubt, the best are Chinese rotors (Long live Barrington and Allora) ... lubricated with Greece grease ... although Grecian Formula keeps the horn looking young.
http://www.grecian-formula.com/

I will agree that rotors are more comfy, and the (usually) clear drainage path to the main tuning slide makes it easy to drain the waste by-products.