Don't go into music!!!

[PWtuba]

I recently had the conductor of one of the music groups I am involved in tell us that if at all possible, don't go into music! The conductor said if you can do anything else besides music, do it. He says music is a long, hard road and a rough business.

But, he also said that if you absolutely cannot live without music, then go for it.

Any thoughts?

[TubaRay]

I understand what he was trying to communicate. Stating it in this exact manner may be a little harsh and misleading.

[MikeMason]

In general,that's pretty good advice.The problem is,you somehow have to support yourself sooner or later.If you can take your passion for something and turn it into a career,you will have a much happier life.Just realize that your career will not be as a full time performer.Gather many skills into your basket that may be marketable.Even the best of our profession do not perform exclusively(there may be an exception or 2).They almost all teach or sell something along with their playing.However,there is no doubt in my mind that music can make for a much richer,happier life,even if it is not the primary way you feed yourself.This is a big decision that will affect the outcome of your life.Think it through and gather lots of advice and opinions before you set out on this path.Steven Covey in his awesome book The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People states-"Start with the end in mind".Very profound.

[Mojo workin']

He's right. Get an engineering degree instead. We import engineers from other parts of the globe because there are not enough Americans to fill the posts.
If you want a "long hard road in a rough business", get a music performance degree.

[Onebaplayer]

as far as i know, oystein is the only person who ONLY plays, and even that isnt totally true because he does master classes.

[pierso20]

He's right. Get an engineering degree instead. We import engineers from other parts of the globe because there are not enough Americans to fill the posts.
If you want a "long hard road in a rough business", get a music performance degree.

A music degree is NOT useless unless you ONLY plan on performing..

And imported engineers are not a result of a lack in engineered degreed people in the US. It is MOSTLY because the pay for outsourced of "imported" engineers is much lower than that here.

A music degree is nice, but as mentioned earlier you have to have many skills in your arsenal to make yourself marketable. It also takes a special kind of person to invest that much time and money, so of course it needs to be a person who is passionate and good at what they do.

Just my opinion.

[JCalkin]

People (quite obviously) make ga-zillions in the restaurant biz...but that's another one that (for similar reasons) doesn't get me all excited...

- open from 5:30 A.M. until 11:00 P.M.

- sell someone a $3 hamburger or a $2 cup of coffee they don't like, and face a $50 million lawsuit.



bloke "Fifteen years ago or so, a certifiable super-b!t¢h threatened to sue me over a French horn that I was renting to her. I said, ' sounds like fun! Let's go!' .....She didn't..."

A friend of mine in the restaurant biz (who, incidentally, I worked for to supplement my music student "income") let me in on the background of what he does.

I'll start by saying that he has no business degree, but instead has been in the restaurant industry since his teenage years, when he worked as a busboy, then a waiter, then an assistant manager, then a manager, and finally through all his back-breaking labor and frugal living (a KEY for him) he purchased his own restaurant in 2006.

He has been very successful and will be "franchising" (opening a second location, which is tantamount to a booming industry in Iowa) soon.

He has said that he profited, in terms of his personal checkbook, more as a manager than as an owner of his one eatery. His profit margin will likely rise in the long term with more than one restaurant operating under his watch.

What he told me was that he has to be very cost-effective, because the restaurant business has the LOWEST profit margin of any privately owned business concern in the United States, going by the industry research he had conducted prior to buying his own place.

Maybe he just told me that so I wouldn't waste napkins, but who knows.

I agree with you completely, Sir Bloke. I would want NO PART of restaurant ownership for just the reasons you describe, plus what I learned from my pal Ken.

Of course, Ken told me that he doesn't understand being a music teacher, either.

[Dean]

Being an *** here is obviously allowed, just keep it civil.

[tbn.al]

I will quote a member of my brass quintet who is a certified genius and has a half dozen patents hanging on his wall. He writes the firmware routines that is imbedded into microchips which do all sorts of neat things. He says, "I have a really nice job which feeds my family well, but it's my music that feeds my soul."

Me too. It's really a nice balance. There is an added benefit to being an amatuer. You get to mostly play what you want with who you want. If someone gets in your face because you mess up, which happens occaisionaly, you can tell them to dock your pay without it costing you a dime. I would never advise someone not to pursue their passion, but realistically only a lucky and talented few make a living from their passion. The rest of us just do the best we can in our spare time.

[brianggilbert]

I taught high school for 5 long years - after a total educational upbringing 100% geared towards a life and career in music education.

All my life - all I wanted to be was an incredible band director. After leaving the business I felt proud of the impact I had on the young adults I worked with. I took marching ensembles to the top Bowl Games in the country, drastically improved recruitment, retention, increased musicanship dramatically, and generally left the program in much better shape than I found it.

Why only 5 years? Why am I working in sales and marketing now?

(1) The time one of my parents drove her CAR into the middle of my band rehearsal...
(2) The time when a student (ticked that she DIDN'T get drum major) attempted to have me fired.
(3) The time my band booster president assaulted me (just shoved me, however he was arrested the year after I left for attacking my replacement and was arrested at his place of business).

Too much stress, too many hours, and too little thanks. I hate that I feel that way, however with goals of having a family and a successful marriage (thankfully now I have both of those!), I felt compelled to move into a different line of work.

Now after 10 years away from performing, I'm now playing again and enjoying every second of it! I feel as if I am now free to enjoy music stress-free and without the threat of a physical beating!

Brian (knowing that the above comments are only a small part of the total story that would make you college music ed major wretch) Gilbert

[Dan Schultz]

He's right. Get an engineering degree instead. ....

Well.... That's probably pretty good advise. I'm a mechanical engineer and enjoyed over 35 years of prosperity in tool design and automation. I'm very happy playing music and doing repair work as my only means of making a living these days, but I'm sure as heck glad that I don't have two girls in college now, either!

I know several music teachers who absolutely hate music and won't lift a hand to toot a note once they leave the classroom for the day.

[tubajoe]

I recently had the conductor of one of the music groups I am involved in tell us that if at all possible, don't go into music! The conductor said if you can do anything else besides music, do it. He says music is a long, hard road and a rough business.

But, he also said that if you absolutely cannot live without music, then go for it.

Any thoughts?

YOU DO WHAT YOU DO. and you are who you are.

If music is what you do and who you are, then that is what you do and you put one foot in front of the other.


You may ask yourself:

Am I playing to live?

or

Am I living to play?

[tubatooter1940]

I didn't play full time until I married and had two ankle biters.
My wife had a "real" job at a newspaper and encouraged me to try and make it as a player.
My kollige advisor told me that if I could play now, why bother to finish school. Good advice, say I.
I had 24 uninterrupted years playing six nights a week and consider myself fortunate to have had the opportunity. My family joined me as much as possible when I played a nice hotel or a bar with a nice dressing room where the kids could peek out and see the crazy dancers.
My pay was close to my wife's wages and although we usually broke even we weren't expecting to get ahead but trying to lead a life that interested us. We couldn't afford a boat but I found a wreck and overhauled it in the back yard.
At my age 39, with both yard apes in high school and no health insurance, the post office hired me and I hung in 21 years. I took a break from music . Life was so simple. Started back playing after a three year hiatus and it was fun again.
You don't need to play six nights to be a "pro". All we need to do is play well enough to make people smile and get a party cookin'.

[TMurphy]

Near St. Louis, a teacher generally has 15 years of experience before reaching $45K per year.

Really?? Wow...that's around the average for a first year teacher here in NJ...

[pierso20]

I believe starting pay in Michigan is in the 30k area. Then again, Michigan is top 5 in teacher pay......

but still....30k aint much...

Though I have agree with the earlier post...life ain't about working to work. It's about working to play. I find life enjoyment to be worth doing a job you enjoy.

[David Zerkel]

She used the instrument as an extension of her brain.

Never heard it put quite this simply. I like it.

[brianggilbert]

She used the instrument as an extension of her brain.

Never heard it put quite this simply. I like it.

Is that why trumpet players are the way they are?...

I'm just sayin'

[Lew]

Near St. Louis, a teacher generally has 15 years of experience before reaching $45K per year.

Really?? Wow...that's around the average for a first year teacher here in NJ...

Maybe I could commute and keep my huge house and property that cost about half of what it would in NJ.

Starting pay in Illinois is on average at 28K. So.....out of curiosity....I'm sending you a pm.

Yea, but the average house that you would want to live in is around $400,000 in NJ and would have property tax of $8,000. That gets you a 3 bedroom 2 bath 40 yr old home in an "ok" neighborhood. NJ has the highest auto insurance and property taxes in the country. The cost of living in NJ more than offsets any higher wages you might be fortunate to earn. I lived there for 40 out of my 52 years and I'm glad to not be living there and hope to never live there again.

As for the band director's comments, I agree that it was a bit harsh, but probably also realistic. I met someone this week who is a tuba performance major at our local university. Yes, it is a large university, but not one of the best known for music. What are the odds of that person getting a gig, or gigs that would allow him to pay his bills? I would say slim to none. That isn't to say that one shouldn't try, but realistically only a small fraction of musicians who go into performance will make a living at making music.

My sister is probably typical. She got a Bachelors in French Horn performance from Oberlin and a Masters from Cincinnati. She has always been a very good horn player, but just below thse who make the cut in major orchestra auditions. She had a brass quintet that was doing ok (with Velvet brown as the tuba player) but it wasn't enough to pay the bills. She has been living from month to month for the past 25 years since her master's degree. She plays in two regional symphonies on a per service basis and takes a lot of private students, and just has enough to live. I'm not saying that there aren't people who are successful and comfortable playing making music for a living, but they are the minority and if you really want to pursue this as a career you should be prepared for that reality.

Obviously there is more to life than money and if my sister, and others in similar situations, didn't get something out of it they wouldn't continue in this career. But, anyone thinking of pursuing performance as a career needs to recognize what's ahead of them.

[TMurphy]

Really?? Wow...that's around the average for a first year teacher here in NJ...

Maybe I could commute and keep my huge house and property that cost about half of what it would in NJ.

Starting pay in Illinois is on average at 28K. So.....out of curiosity....I'm sending you a pm.

Yea, but the average house that you would want to live in is around $400,000 in NJ and would have property tax of $8,000. That gets you a 3 bedroom 2 bath 40 yr old home in an "ok" neighborhood. NJ has the highest auto insurance and property taxes in the country. The cost of living in NJ more than offsets any higher wages you might be fortunate to earn. I lived there for 40 out of my 52 years and I'm glad to not be living there and hope to never live there again.

All of this, is, of course, true. It's 'spensive to live here, no doubt about it. But, unfortunately for me, all of my family and all of friends are here, so it's home. I do know some people who live out in PA and commute to work (including an elementary school band director who commutes nearly two hours every day), and they do it to try and have the best of both worlds--higher wages, lower cost of living.

One interesting thing....though nearly EVERYTHING is more expensive around here, gas is actually a bit cheaper than most neighboring states. Go figure.

[TubaRay]

That isn't to say that one shouldn't try, but realistically only a small fraction of musicians who go into performance will make a living at making music.

It pretty much comes down to this(IMHO).