Is buffing always bad?

[Udi]

I like vintage horns, and I like it when you can see their age. I don't have any problem with worn out lacquer or silver.
I also know that buffing a horn to get the old plating off for replating can dammage the metal and subsequently its sound.

But sometimes you don't have choice - an instrument is already replated and you have to consider if you want it or not. So what do you think, does buffing necessarily harm an instrument? Would you stay away from buying a relacquered tuba or sousaphone? As relaquering conceals the instrument's real condition, what would you look for in such an horn or beware of?

I would really appreciate your feedback!

[bort]

I think that if it's already been done, you are at an advantage... it's just like any other used tuba at that point. You can try it, and if you like it, go with it.

The trouble is when you have an old tuba and think "what if..."

[Dan Schultz]

Yes.... you do not need to buff a horn to remove either the lacquer or the plating. Lacquer can be stripped chemically and plating can be removed either chemically or by electrolysis.

That being said... buffing is normally used to remove scratches and surface imperfections prior to applying lacquer or new plating. THAT's where the damage is done. In order to remove a scratch... the depth of the scratch is how much metal that has to be removed from the surrounding area to make the scratch disappear.

Refinishing a horn is pretty much a 'catch 22'. Some have experimented with heavy copper plating to fill scratches. Of course... in this case the entire area has to be buffed to remove the copper from the area surrounding a scratch. Many horns have a 'strike' coat of copper to make other plating 'stick' so this is probably not a bad option.

Bight and shiny is nice but I prefer to leave the remaining metal on my horns.

[Daniel C. Oberloh]

It comes down to a number of factors. First is the age and condition of the instrument and the original design and construction methods used in its creation. The other is the knowledge and skill of the individual performing the task. Like Tinker mentioned, finishes can be removed for the most part, without buffing. I will add that silver and gold plate removal through electro-strip is quite aggressive and is not recommended on hand-made or older high-end instruments. Refinishing is the last stages of restoration on a tuba and if done with care can have very satisfying results but in order to achieve those results other factors have to be taken into account such as the condition of the valves, the quality of the dent removal, and the quality of fit and soldering work performed on the braces and ALL joint connections. All of the before mentioned factors have equal bearing on the final results of how the instrument will sound. Overly aggressive sanding and polishing can results in thinning the material, washing out the details and modeling the whole look of the instrument and these are all bad but it does not have to be the case if the work is performed with knowledge, care and a good deal of skill.

Daniel C. Oberloh
Oberloh Woodwind and Brass Works
http://www.oberloh.com" target="_blank

[Sam Gnagey]

I don't like to take the chance with the horns that we put together. That's why you'll find them with plated bells and bottom bows with the rest minimally polished brass. I've had a bell electronicly striped to find that the seam in the bell has been degraded by the process.

[jsmn4vu]

Is there a method for cleaning the brass without buffing that would make it acceptable for relacquering with a tinted lacquer, like gold?

I really dont want to buff it, the metal on my bell is thin enough already

Different, but related: Once saw a french horn that had been oxidized -- some might say artistically -- to show multi "autumn leaves" colors, then clear lacquered (high gloss). Interesting effect.

[The Big Ben]

I think satin finishes are created with bead blasting.

[WilliamVance]

I just had my Martin Sousaphone relaquered in gold tint and some deeper scratches were left. They are hardly noticeable. The engraving was not overly buffed and is sharp. I think the horn plays better but I also had a valve rebuild so that could be why. I think a very acceptable job can be done without removing too much metal but the owner had to accept the instrument may not look exactly new and play well. Think compromise between vanity and musicality. I prefer the look of a shiny sousaphone and look forward to having it on display for my Christmas party!