ophicleid substitutes

[eupho]

In addition to F or EEb Tuba(Symphonie Fantastique), what other instruments have been employed as substitutes for the venerable ophicleid?

Euphonium?
British Baritine?
Cimbasso?

[Dan Schultz]

Kazoo maybe?

[iiipopes]

The original tubas that were developed to replace ophicleides were in F and had narrow bores, a tall, narrow bugle and bell, and five or six valves in a 3+2 or 3+3 configuration to help ophicleide players make the transition.

So...that said, any small bore, small bell tuba or cimbasso of whatever configuration should be just fine.

I'm actually having to consider this myself: my community band is playing a woodwind ensemble transcription that calls for a contra-bassoon, but since there are no contra-bassoons in the area, much less players, I was asked to play the part on tuba. But I'm trying to figure out a tonality that will blend and support the woodwinds better than a broad, dark tuba tone. I thought of ophicleide, but we have a limited number of rehearsals, and I don't want to invest in one just for one concert piece. So I'm looking for either a 3/4 tuba or a cimbasso to borrow to perform the piece on.

[MikeW]

I'm sure I remember reading that the original transition was to bombardon, which was ophicleid shaped, but with valves. I have seen a picture of one with (I think) seven ascending valves, and another beast that had three descending valves, looking much like a cornet trying to mate with an ophicleid. I would guess they lost ground to Baritone or Bass Saxe-horns.

I vaguely recollect reading somewhere that Wieprecht designed the BassTuba as an improved bombardon, and renamed it BassTuba so he could patent it.

The ophicleid fluence seems to have faded rapidly; there doesn't seem to be much difference between later bombardons and tubas - I think they were just named bombardons because Wieprecht still owned the rights on the "tuba" name.

Found the 7-valve odd-ball picture:

IT.DSMFI.STR0001.0000273.0001.jpg

I'm pretty sure this beast has a short semitone (for use with high notes) a longer semitone for use with lower notes, and a valve each for 4, 3, 2, or 1 whole tone.(EDIT: sorry, also 5 whole tones)

[Donn]

what other instruments have been employed as substitutes for the venerable ophicleid?

Don't forget the ophicleide

[Bob Kolada]

I posted a YouTube link a while back to a European group that had a guy playing the bass line on one of those.

[UDELBR]

French tuba.

[eupho]

Ah yes, bombardon and french tuba.

[ken k]

many years ago I was hired to play an ophicleide part on trombone. I can't recall the piece. I recall thinking it would be better on a euphonium. The British style baritone might be a good choice too if you have the fourth valve to get the lower pitches below the staff. It would have a smaller sound similar to the ophicleide.
but nowadays in larger orchestras with trumpet and trombone players player larger equipment you may not have to worry too much about using a smaller horn. A euph or small tuba probably would be just fine.

kk

[TheGoyWonder]

Courtois has something that appears to be a modern take on the French tuba. You can get traditional multiple-multiple valves, or 4-valve compensation like a euph.

Despite being euphonium-like, it doesn't have that familiar sugar-sweet euphonium sound. It's brassier, sounding between a bass trombone and a marching baritone. Seems to have a tighter bell throat with more flare, possibly fed by mega leadpipe and mega mouthpiece. In action:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGDXT1YCRfQ

Probably closer to ophicleid than euphonium is. Could be a nice sound along with a trombone section, with just enough extra weight on a bass trombone to deepen the sound.

[Wyvern]

Wessex will have both Eb and F valved ophicleides based on original 19th century designs out next year developed in association with leading UK ophicleide player, Tony George. These use the same bell and bows as our keyed ophicleide, so not surprisingly has 'real ophicleide' like tone. We hope will make good substitute to play with modern orchestra.

I tried out development prototype playing Berlioz myself with orchestra and got good feedback. In most orchestras it is now recognised that cimbasso is more appropriate than tuba for Verdi. I think that equally applies for Berlioz to be played by valve ophicleide.