Dating a Piggy?

[arpthark]

No, I don't need romantic advice.

I've come across a nice little Cerveny Piggy and I was wondering if anybody could help me with a date of manufacture. It's stamped with the CSSR marking and has "made in Czechoslovakia" on the receiver, so that puts it between 1960 and 1989, of course. It also has the "thermometer bulb" second valve, big thumb ring and elaborate engraving. However, it doesn't have the big spatula paddles that I've seen on old Cervenys - I guess they could have been replaced with more modern-looking ones at some point, though they are quite worn so I'm inclined to think they're original.

Just from eyeballing other photos of Piggies, mine seems to be one of the slightly taller ones. Not sure what that means as far as dates go.

Here are some pics. It plays wonderfully!

[arpthark]

Thanks for the leads, Mark. It is an odd horn. The lacquer is actually in fairly good shape and I don't see any signs of scarring from where the leadpipe could have been replaced... I suppose it could have been relacquered, but everything looks original to me. Also I don't see a serial number anywhere. I've been searching the piggy thread and I don't see anything else like it! It's a fantastic little tuba though. If I had to guess, I would say mid 70s to early 80s, but that's just speculation.

[arpthark]

a leadpipe is much easier to replace than the engraving on the bell.

Ha! Good point. I wonder if anyone can provide info about the "tall" vs. "short" Piggies... I seem to remember reading something about it before but can't find the source. I think the tall ones (mine) were older, so you might be on the right track, Mark.

[doublebuzzing]

Those valve paddles must be replacements because I don't think the older Cerveny tubas used those ones.

[arpthark]

It's on my list but I just got the tuba a few days ago. Norm and I know each other pretty well and we play in some groups together, so he will see it sooner or later. It needs a valve alignment and some minor dent work.

Looking at more pics, I think you guys are right that the paddles are replacements. I've contacted the eBay seller for some more info and history so we will see soon.

[boobentuben]

[arpthark]

^ Thank you for that, very informative.

Thought I should also say the receiver is very large - not as big as my Alex, of course, but definitely bigger than modern ones. Helleberg will go all the way up to the cup, almost, and my larger-shank PTs go up pretty far on the shank as well.

FWIW, serial number is 722XX... I emailed Cerveny about it. Might not lead anywhere, but worth a shot!

[JCradler]

There it is AGAIN! I'm almost positive I used to own that tuba! A bit of history, as it was told to me: It was imported around 1973 by Ron Apperson (the mute guy) and had string linkage. John Stevens bought it and had the linkages swapped out. He also had the leadpipe raised and curved around the bell more abruptly. The thumb ring was also moved- you may be able to see evidence of this as well. The give away was the hook on the first valve slide. He had this installed for easier reach to the slide. Last pic I saw of this tuba it had a patch on the top bow that has appeared since I sold the tuba in 2002. When I bought it in 1987, it was quite scarred from all the soldering work. Around 1992, I had it cleaned, minimally de-dented and re-lacquered at Mizell Music in Hagerstown, MD. That is why the lacquer looks so good. Since 2002, I don't know where it's been. Hopefully folks have enjoyed playing it. I was told that the import duty on the tuba back in the day was basically 100% of the horn's price since it was from a communist bloc country. That said, the bell engraving is really cool.
John Stevens used this tuba for the opening Broadway run of "Barnum", I believe and also toured with Chuck Mangione with it. I used it on that fateful( in a good way) day back in 1989 when I auditioned for the Marine Band. It is a special one. At the time I sold it, the valves and leadpipe were in need of replacing. Have you had any of this work done?
After studying the pix and the serial #, I'm sure it was mine. The serial # is on the bridge under the 4th valve, if I recall.
Okay, sentimental journey complete. Take good care of it!

John Cradler

[arpthark]

Yes! There is a patch on the top bow. Mystery solved. It's a fantastic player. Thanks for the history!

[arpthark]

And no, I just bought it this week. Lead pipe and valves seem good though so perhaps it's been fixed up a bit since 2002.

[eupher61]

If you really want to date her, looks like she's available.