Small shank mouthpiece

[bone-a-phone]

I'm looking for a small shank tuba mouthpiece (large shank trombone size) for a very light BBb tuba for a trombone player who doubles. I've got a Kellyberg blue and its not doing the job. It feels like it needs real metal (more weight) . I'd also like something cheap (even used would be ok) , because I know what kind of rabbit hole the search for the perfect mouthpiece can be. I'm not playing at Carnegie Hall, just for my own edification at this point. Suggestions?

[bone-a-phone]

I cant make an informed decision about dimensions without experience. It took me $1000 to figure out trombone mouthpieces. I do have a Faxx Helleberg that isn't worth anything to me as it is, maybe I'll try your method on that. That seems like a fairly generic starting point.

[bone-a-phone]

I ask because otherwise I buy Hellebergs that are too big or Kellys that are too light or... whatever my next mistake is. Its a little surprising there aren't more small shanks out there. Kelly makes a stainless one (expensive) and Wick seems to make some more reasonably priced.

[Donn]

I have a blue Kelleyberg. I sometimes wonder if the distinctive tonal qualities are due to the polycarbonate material, or due to the blue color. My green 1½G doesn't partake of the same tonal quality, so I have some grounds for my color theory. I would have gotten a green Kelleyberg too, if it had been available at the time ... ah, those eternal regrets, but how was I to know?

But really, I am pretty sure it has more to do with the shape of the throat, or a distant 2nd possibility the shape of the cup wall.

That 1½G is of course large/bass trombone shank. Pretty small for a tuba, but everyone's different.

[Matt G]

Call Dillon’s or some other shops that might have some serviceable small Eb mouthpieces laying around.

[bone-a-phone]

I checked the euphonium forum and it looks like Denis Wick 4 is the way to go.. Its a little odd, because its a BBb with a small receiver. Probablt the right thing to do is to swap the receiver. I still may do that down the line, but for now Wick's the thing. Thanks for input.

[marking]

I also have an old small receiver Eb tuba.

Kelly also makes a small shank tuba MP. I believe they call it "X Small". I felt its was a little big for my Eb, though I could eventually acclimate to it. And you don't want plastic.

I picked up a used Schilke 60 large shank bass trombone MP. It's wider, deeper and has bigger back bore than a 1 1/2G. The rim is narrow, so it's a little more "sharp" on the lips.

[tbonesullivan]

Having looked into this myself, Eb mouthpieces are the way to go. Almost all the readily available tuba mouthpieces are for the tuba shank, not large shank trombone.

[bone-a-phone]

The Wick piece arrived today. Wick has a decent selection of small shank mouthpieces for tuba. It seems odd for an otherwise 4/4 BBb to take a small shank, but this one does, probably because of its indeterminate age. Sounds good. Fits right.

I have a number of big bass bone mouthpieces, and none of them had much "tubaness" about them. I was surprised at how well the plastic piece worked, but metal is definitely better.

[iiipopes]

The Wick piece arrived today. Wick has a decent selection of small shank mouthpieces for tuba. It seems odd for an otherwise 4/4 BBb to take a small shank, but this one does, probably because of its indeterminate age. Sounds good. Fits right.

I have a number of big bass bone mouthpieces, and none of them had much "tubaness" about them. I was surprised at how well the plastic piece worked, but metal is definitely better.

When I had a Besson New Standard BBb 3-valve comp with .730 bore, the Wick 1 (no letter) mouthpiece was THE mouthpiece that sounded best on it. This was the British standard for decades until the Sovereign. Along with that, I also used a Kelly 18 outdoors. Even though it did not insert as far into the receiver, it did its job well. Being a bowl cup instead of a funnel cup, it gave the tuba a "My American Cousin" tone, but the overall tone and intonation and response remained superlative.

[Big Toot]

I'm currently using a Denis Wick 3S for my English-style receiver. I'm not sure what quite to make of it yet as the only other mouthpieces I've ever played were Schilkes.

[bone-a-phone]

I got a DW 4, which is nice, but the sound doesn't have much depth. I think I'll try a 1 next.

[Big Toot]

I got a DW 4, which is nice, but the sound doesn't have much depth. I think I'll try a 1 next.

Something feels off to me about my 3S, and I want to say something similar about the depth of the sound, but since DW is the only manufacturer for tuba mouthpieces that fit my receiver, I am using them for now. This is part of the reason I asked the question about changing my receiver to its original.

[iiipopes]

I got a DW 4, which is nice, but the sound doesn't have much depth. I think I'll try a 1 next.

Something feels off to me about my 3S, and I want to say something similar about the depth of the sound, but since DW is the only manufacturer for tuba mouthpieces that fit my receiver, I am using them for now. This is part of the reason I asked the question about changing my receiver to its original.

Perantucci makes the small shank to order on any of their mouthpieces.

[tofu]

.

[Big Toot]

I got a DW 4, which is nice, but the sound doesn't have much depth. I think I'll try a 1 next.

Something feels off to me about my 3S, and I want to say something similar about the depth of the sound, but since DW is the only manufacturer for tuba mouthpieces that fit my receiver, I am using them for now. This is part of the reason I asked the question about changing my receiver to its original.

Get a 3, no letter

(3s would probably be a small,shank verison if the 3SL, a shallow F/Eb tuba mouthpuece)

I actually have a small receiver, and it won't accept any European or American shanked mouthpiece. If it is based off of an Eb/F mouthpiece, that may be part of my discontent with it then.

[Big Toot]

I got a DW 4, which is nice, but the sound doesn't have much depth. I think I'll try a 1 next.

Something feels off to me about my 3S, and I want to say something similar about the depth of the sound, but since DW is the only manufacturer for tuba mouthpieces that fit my receiver, I am using them for now. This is part of the reason I asked the question about changing my receiver to its original.

Perantucci makes the small shank to order on any of their mouthpieces.

I did not know that. I'll have to give them a try. Thanks for the heads up.

[bone-a-phone]

I got a DW 4, which is nice, but the sound doesn't have much depth. I think I'll try a 1 next.

If you are a trombone player do not get a 1 before a 2. You don't mention what actual horn you have ...Coming from a trombone mouthpiece you will feel like your swimming in a 1. As a tuba player I have a Wick 1 and still prefer the 2. Of course everybody will have a different physique etc so your mileage may vary - but I think a 2 makes more sense for you to try before a 1 IMHO.

My tuba doesn't have any engraving on it, but it looks to me like an old Cerveny (walter sears stencil import or custom development job). It's at least from the 1960s, but I'll bet it goes back to the 30s or maybe even earlier. (pic below, if you can identify it) It's a 4/4 BBb.

I'm a tenor player kind of forced into bass bone, and now dabbling in tuba. My bass bone mouthpieces are around a Yamaha 60 in size - big, but not huge. I'm still getting used to the amount of air a tuba takes.

[tofu]

.

[iiipopes]

I actually have a small receiver, and it won't accept any European or American shanked mouthpiece. If it is based off of an Eb/F mouthpiece, that may be part of my discontent with it then.

Apples and oranges. the Wick 3 mouthpiece is a rather deep funnel cup, but with a slightly smaller inside rim diameter. They make two models: the 3 (no letter), which is the small shank, and the 3L, which is the "American" shank. Unlike Perantucci, which arbitrarily labels certain mouthpieces as suitable for Eb/F, Wick does not differentiate. They do agree that the 3 is a good mouthpiece and widely used for a Besson Eb comp.

For clarity of nomenclature, Wick does NOT make a "3S." That is what some people call the smaller shank, when the correct model designation is 3 (no letter). By contrast, Perantucci, on the same shank size, does add the suffix "S," to distinguish as smaller than an American shank, or their hybrid shank size, which to fit as many tubas as possible without a custom order, seems to be now .520, between an "American" .510 and the "European" .530 shanks.

I suggest reading both the Denis Wick model chart, which can be downloaded from a number of sources, and Matt Walter's post, frequently quoted and copied, explaining the difference between tuba shank sizes, which the British old standard is not necessarily the same as "bass trombone" standard.