Besson 794

[elimia]

Hello everyone,

Does anyone have experience with the Besson 794? After playing on one for awhile with lots of practice on it, I am wondering if the tuba is too big for me. It seems like the low register is largely unusable. No matter how much air I put into the horn, those low notes (from F two octaves below staff and below) don't come out well and aren't usable.

Have others found this horn difficult to fill out in the low register? My last horn was a Conn 10J, obviously not too bad in terms of air volume.

[GeoffC_UK]

Morning,
Not enough intel for people to answer your question precisely.
Age and condition of your horn?

For example: depressing the 4th piston pulls in the compensating system (extra pipe length). This can feel stuffy in the low end over a non-compensating horn. However, my 782 had a tiny corrosion hole in it, which led to a loss of power in the low register - had to work really hard, too hard to make a noise. Hole was plugged and all is fine now.

[iiipopes]

As Geoff said, we need more info:

1) age of horn
2) condition of horn
3) mouthpiece - if you are using a Wick 1 with its large throat, you need a third lung to blow the low notes, even on a horn in perfect condition (from experience)
4) the ensemble you are playing in
5) are you referring to notes below the F 4th valve below open BBb two ledger lines and a space below the bass clef
6) have you had any other work done to the horn

With no more information, it does sound like a leak or a bad brace or an obstruction.

[elimia]

As Geoff said, we need more info:

1) age of horn
2) condition of horn
3) mouthpiece - if you are using a Wick 1 with its large throat, you need a third lung to blow the low notes, even on a horn in perfect condition (from experience)
4) the ensemble you are playing in
5) are you referring to notes below the F 4th valve below open BBb two ledger lines and a space below the bass clef
6) have you had any other work done to the horn

With no more information, it does sound like a leak or a bad brace or an obstruction.

Yeah here is the info:

1990 horn (made in England). Great condition post restoration. Has a 4 valve block from a Yamaha 321 installed, but tied into existing tubing. Plays great in other registers. Non compensating horn.

I do an electrobrass project, don't play in an ensemble.

Yes, the lower range is the octave below the octave below staff is the issue. It's like blowing into a trash bag.

Perantucci 64 mouthpiece.

[elimia]

Bump

[circusboy]

(from F two octaves below staff and below)

Just curious: Are you talking about eight spaces below the staff or 16? In either case, how far below that could you go on your 10J?

[elimia]

Eight spaces below the staff. I could get a usable low E out of the 10J. The 794 isn't the best horn overall, it has several intonation issues, but works for me in a rock type project. But the low register (below low F#) is unusable.

[GeoffC_UK]

That's a lot of custom work.
1990 was a good year at the Edgware Factory, London, from a build standard perspective.
The BBb 794 is from the "Imperial" family and is a tried and tested model.
It had a 3 + 1 piston arrangement and is a compensating horn in its as-built state.
Fitting a YBB 4-in-a-row block and loosing the compensation is quite a modification of pipework.
Certainly worth getting it checked out by a tuba fabricator/ repairer to make sure all is good with your horn's modifications.

I play a PT-65 on my 782 EEb (1982 build) and have a PT-64 in my collection.
I don't think I'd use either playing a BBb, especially the PT-64 which I use for high range work only.

If I wanted to go low I'd use a Bach 24AW or Denis Wick 2L (in the UK, that is) with a B&H/ Besson BBb.
But mouthpieces are a very personal choice.

[peterbas]

Deleted

[elimia]

Yeah, definitely not a compensator, it doesn't have the extra tubing. I suspect that the inline 4 valve block maybe has changed its playing characteristics, but I don't have any idea what baseline compression/low register looks like on an old 794. I'll probably keep it, as it has a very nice resonant ringing 'Besson' sound, but just won't be able to use the low register.