wchoc86 wrote:, or the swastika (that was originally a native american symbol for peace) are totally wrong, and at the very least tactless(although I probably should be the last person for calling people out on that) to display/say in public.
note that the the 'peaceful swastika is usually found reversed :
as opposed to the Nazi Swastika:
you can see the offensive swastika is not the same as the original, it is already a perversion.
Ithaca College, B.M. 2009
University of Nebraska - Lincoln, M.M. 2017, D.M.A. 2020
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wchoc86 wrote:i've heard that too, although it was philly, pitt and Alabama in the middle, though I guess it hardly matters. (although wasn't Kentucky a border state and not in the confederacy?)
The point is that central Pennsylvania is absolutely nothing like the South. No resemblance at all, except that the residents are mostly non-urban. Having spent time in both central PA and Alabama, I can say with some conviction that they are utterly dissimilar.
I doubt I could find any native Pennsylvanian that would identify with the Confederacy in any way, or who would know how to do so even if so inclined.
Rick "who lives right at the closest point between the South and Pennsylvania" Denney
Some observations for consideration by the young'uns:
1. The Civil War was a clash between two economic systems. One was slavery-in-fact, and the other depended on so-called wage slaves. Considering the working conditions of both groups, it was hard in 1855 to make a strong moral case that one was worse than the other. That moral case is much more clear now--wage slavery provided the potential for improvement of the quality of life of the working class, while slavery-in-fact did not. But this wasn't clear when the debate was raging in this country.
2. There was no belief in the political world of the 1850's about the status of blacks as full-fledged citizens in America. Pro-slavery southerners wanted them as slaves, and wage-earners in the North wanted them shipped back to Africa (as espoused in these years by Lincoln on moral grounds). Why? Because the Irish and German immigrants in the North (particularly in the Old Northwest--Ohio, Illinois, etc.) saw blacks as economically competitive. Nothing promotes racial tension like economic competition. Those who debated against slavery on moral grounds were often the purveyors of the greatest violence seen leading up to the Civil War. The reason northerners didn't want slavery in the newly colonized western states (there was no argument about it in the already settled eastern states) is because they were hoping to go there and escape wage slavery. The most violent clashes between pro and anti-slavery forces before the war were in Kansas. There's a reason the Missouri Compromise is called the Missouri Compromise, and not, say, the Ohio or Alabama Compromise.
3. No racial group has the corner on the racism market. Being victims of poor treatment by members of another race is not the province of any particular race. "All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
4. By my observation, southerners are more apt to say things that northerners interpret as racist, while actually maintaining a respectful and productive relationship with members of other races. Northerners avoid saying things that trigger accusations of racism, but in my observation are at least as apt to treat persons of other races poorly, and are more apt to maintain separation in daily life. Martians, in observing what people do rather than what they say, would see the race differently quite differently than we like to believe.
Example: I know a tuba player who regularly performs with a New Orleans jazz band whose members are otherwise black. The other members don't look on my friend as being black, because he is not black and doesn't act in accordance with black culture. They don't expect him to. But they respect him as a tuba player and as a person of integrity, just as he respects them as musicians and persons of integrity, both having earned that respect in the context of their relationship. That mutual respect means more than what either might believe in their abstract view of other races. On the other hand, I've seen those from northern states who do not live among persons of other races try to fit in by adopting the cultural expressions of those races. They receive ridicule and mistrust instead of respect for what is perceived as patronizing behavior, by my observation. The elite classes anywhere are remarkably good at being patronizing, especially when they want to use that as a spotlight to highlight their elite status.
5. Most people don't have a clue about history and make all sorts of offensive assumptions about people who live in other places. There seems to be a correlation between youth and historical ignorance.
Rick "thinking victims usually get pity rather than respect" Denney
bloke wrote:I would compare Lincoln's 11th-hour highlighting of the issue of "slavery" (in order to garner addition desperately-needed support of a very unpopular war) to our current President's "weapons of mass destruction" issue.
I don't want to encourage politics, but it shore seemed to this Yankee boy, after all he was said and taught, that the previously mentioned war was mostly about union vrs. state's rights.
The fact that anybody did the right thing in retrospect was purely coincidental.
Instead of talking to your plants, if you yelled at them would they still grow, but only to be troubled and insecure?
wchoc86 wrote:
Curtis "who still doesn't like trucks" Scharding-Taras
I wish I could say that I don't like people who don't like trucks, however that wouldn't be true. The truth is it absolutely doesn't matter to me at all whether you like trucks or not.
wchoc86 wrote:i've heard that too, although it was philly, pitt and Alabama in the middle, though I guess it hardly matters. (although wasn't Kentucky a border state and not in the confederacy?)
The point is that central Pennsylvania is absolutely nothing like the South. No resemblance at all, except that the residents are mostly non-urban. Having spent time in both central PA and Alabama, I can say with some conviction that they are utterly dissimilar.
I doubt I could find any native Pennsylvanian that would identify with the Confederacy in any way, or who would know how to do so even if so inclined.
Rick "who lives right at the closest point between the South and Pennsylvania" Denney
Brent Burns wrote, " If it's snow bird season, why can't we shoot 'em? Pack 'em up. Sack 'em up and send 'em back overnight air.Take your attitude and your wife's blue hair. Don't tell us how you did it up North "cause we don't care."
