quinterbourne wrote:Bloke, I know exactly what you're saying about organists/choirmasters sometimes (I think often) being tools... and I find it quite amusing as well!
MaryAnn wrote:I actually think there is a cultural influence here.
FWIW I have noticed a BIG difference overall in the attitude of vocalists vs. instrumentalists. You are one or the other; some vocalists may play an instrument and many instrumentalists sing, but personality wise you are one or the other - rarely is there a middle ground. I think most instrumentalists have a hard time understanding the "unique, colorful" personality of vocalists, and many vocalists have a hard time understanding reality.
I went to a college where the two camps were very divided and grew to hate singing and singers with a passion, until I student taught middle school choirs where this "cultural animosity" had not yet set in, and singing actually became fun again.
MartyNeilan wrote:FWIW I have noticed a BIG difference overall in the attitude of vocalists vs. instrumentalists. You are one or the other; some vocalists may play an instrument and many instrumentalists sing, but personality wise you are one or the other - rarely is there a middle ground. I think most instrumentalists have a hard time understanding the "unique, colorful" personality of vocalists, and many vocalists have a hard time understanding reality.
I went to a college where the two camps were very divided and grew to hate singing and singers with a passion, until I student taught middle school choirs where this "cultural animosity" had not yet set in, and singing actually became fun again.
One of my kids graduated from music conservatory. She and her friends would sit around in the snack bar/lounge and occasionally make fun of the vocal majors by imitating them sight singing:
- wrong pitches
- out of tune
- with deep expression, vibrato, perfect posture, and hand gestures
LOL exactly right Bloke!! In addition, their egotism far outpaces all but the most extreme instrumentalists. I know quite a few singers who truly think they are "God's gift to the world" and more that a few who think they ARE God. The world revolves around them and their voice, and they aren't afraid to remind you as often as necessary, in every way possible.
Bloke and marty, you have spoken some very true words indeed. Around here its generally not the vocal majors themselves, but several of the vocal profs who have a little bit of the complex you mentioned. It is interesting how the two camps of people are divided though. Although this is a really small music department here and I should know everyone, I will sometimes look at the upcoming recitals and wonder "who in the world are they and what do they do?" usually its a vocalist that I am wondering about.
Music majors in general have been looked at as real snobs that exclude non majors at this university. I have tried to overcome the stereotype, and in retrospect I think I was quite successful. There were (and are) some jazzers that had kind of an elitist attitude and were general jerks to anyone they thought was a hack, wether or not that was true.
I guess what really really burns me is when someone is really really good, but is a complete jerk. Or perceptions of people change just because of that persons attitude.... (if someone acts really good and they are only marginally so, many will regard them as awesome players)
After I was honorably discharged from the Army and headed back to college, I went to a tiny school where I was offered a huge music scholarship and was able to live with my wife (and later my daughter, when she was born) in university housing. Being a small school, it was not big enough to have its own band and, for most of the time, I was the only one in my music school class that wasn't majoring in voice or piano. In fact, it was so small I was the only music major who graduated in 1989. Anyway, I learned to tolerate voice majors. I just stayed quiet, pretending they weren't there. The grad school I attended, a theological seminary, was also heavy with voice majors. Because of the nature of the school, we had to be as proficient as singers as we were as pianists. That didn't make me like singing more. In fact, inside I was having a fight. My private voice teachers couldn't understand how someone with a good voice could hate singing so much. Again, I kept quiet. When I passed the vocal barriers and got through the other required singing courses, school was fun again.
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You only have one chance to make a first impression. Don't blow it.
I was happy as an instrumentalist until one day the singers all quit our 5 piece band. We hired 2 more that had never sung either and everybody divided up the tune list and went home to drill the vocals. The first two weeks were dismal but the bar owner was a patient fellow and within a month things were sounding better and the harmonies were starting to happen. A year together found us all happy with each other and fully employed.
All the musicians that took up singing that fateful day continued singing throughout their careers and our bass player was offered a contract with RCA records due to his ruined voice. The rest of us at least achieved competence with our vocals and have been much more employable ever since.
Nobody from that bunch ever developed a prima donna atitude or felt we were entitled to one. We just feel lucky to have had the opportunity to learn while being paid and more fortunate to all be working this late in our careers.
My (to remain nameless, but I'm sure previously mentioned) alma mater had a notorious feud between the "throats" and "musicians".
My favorite story:
I'm in a practice room one day next to a male throat who was working on a solo. He was practicing this run that ended on a G above the staff (I think). This guy was screaming these notes out over and over agian, and I was getting annoyed. Blasting The Ride at FFFF didn't seem to phase him, so I needed a new way to ***k with him. Therefor I decided to blast Fs and C#s when he was about to hit the top of his run.
Two minutes later, he switched practice rooms. However, I didn't stay in my room much longer because I had blown my chops.
Scooby Tuba wrote:
Side note: The pic says "made in the USA". Can you imaging what the person printing those must think? Probably thinks "Tubenet" is a porno site!
You mean it's not!!! What have I been doing wasting my time here, then!? (I thought the REALLY GOOD shots were just taking a LONG TIME to download!)
Instead of talking to your plants, if you yelled at them would they still grow, but only to be troubled and insecure?
music conservatory. She and her friends would sit around in the snack bar/lounge and occasionally make fun of the vocal majors by imitating them sight singing:
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