Single tonguing

XtremeEuph · Post by **XtremeEuph** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 5:33 pm

Recently I had a discussion with Ken about single tonguing and realised that this is one area where I really lack in. I never noticed until we talked about it and did some reading. I have been having trouble keeping up to fast tempos (even eighth notes) and am in the need of double tonguing many sixteenth notes because my single tonguing speed is really slow. Without buzzing and without a mouthpiece, I can only single tongue sixteenths at about a quarter = 88-90. I would really like to increase my speed and clarity because this just won't do for my standards. Are there any specific exercises to work on? Or is it just practice single tonguing fast every day. I read something about completely relaxing, no tension but wasn't sure how i could prevent the tension. Anyway, hope you guys can help me out.

Thanks alot

Kevin

oldbandnerd · Post by **oldbandnerd** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 7:13 pm

Maybe you swallowed your cat and that's why you can't double... errr...... single tounge .

XtremeEuph · Post by **XtremeEuph** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 7:44 pm

double tongue?...........right tommmmmmmmmmmmy

Sandman333 · Post by **Sandman333** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 9:48 pm

Just tongue along with a metronome on one pitch. And then bump it up a notch after ten seconds or so. It's a very simple (boring) exercise to practice attacks, but you can work on consistency at the same time if you focus on exactly the same quality for each note.

iiipopes · Post by **iiipopes** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 10:21 pm

Hey oldbandnerd -- when I saw the picture, I laughed out loud! Great! Anyway, tonguing for tuba is, I believe, different than tonguing for other brass. Instead of trying to get a crisp "T" sound as, for example, trumpet players do for a good fanfare, I tongue almost as a "d" or "th" as in "then." I do this by using a little bit more of my tongue than just the very tip against where the upper incisors meet the hard palate, while at the same time keeping the rest of the oral cavity and throat open and relaxed. Americans should be the best at articulation on tuba, because with American English, as opposed to British English, most of us naturally soften the "t" consonants, especially if they are in the middle of a word, like "matter," almost to a "d" sound. That may be a better way of explaining how I tongue. But I don't let it get to the thick part of my tongue, so I can still double tongue when necessary.

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Sat Jun 17, 2006 11:09 pm

XtremeEuph wrote:Without buzzing and without a mouthpiece, I can only single tongue sixteenths at about a quarter = 88-90.

Don't feel too bad. My single tonguing is even slower than yours.

Unfortunately, my double-tonguing isn't quite clean enough to pick up where my single-tonguing leaves off.

Rick "sigh." Denney

XtremeEuph · Post by **XtremeEuph** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 12:35 am

Tommy you damn stalker, that actually the same breed of cat as mine (both of them)

pulseczar · Post by **pulseczar** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 1:11 am

the Brass Gym has a good workout for single tonging. They stress that it will come with time and consistent practicing. The law of accomodation.

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 2:13 pm

Many people who single tongue unsatisfactorally have themselves surgically altered to remedy the problem:

oldbandnerd · Post by **oldbandnerd** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 2:53 pm

That's gross Windshieldbug .

XtremeEuph · Post by **XtremeEuph** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 10:33 pm

so, now they double tongue?

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 10:38 pm

XtremeEuph wrote:so, now they double tongue?

A side benefit, and Sensamaya is a piece of cake...

Mark · Post by **Mark** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:46 am

Two thoughts on this topic.

1) I was at a master class where Steven Mead said that some people are physically unable to single tongue quickly. I'm sorry I don't remember the details.

2) I was at another master class where Steve Fissel, Principal Bass Trombone of the Seattle Symphony, said he could not single tongue 16ths faster than quarter = 98. This really stuck in my memory, because I also seem to be stuck at 98. He went on to describe how he works around the speed limitation without resorting to double tonguing.

XtremeEuph · Post by **XtremeEuph** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 1:58 pm

Thank you very much Brian that is great help...

And Mark could you please expand on number 2?

XtremeEuph · Post by **XtremeEuph** » Tue Jun 27, 2006 12:30 pm

I guess patience is key, im slowly getting along. My secure 80 is now in the 90's off the horn (quarter=90-96 sixteenths)!!!

XtremeEuph · Post by **XtremeEuph** » Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:23 pm

ok, thanks again Brian

MaryAnn · Post by **MaryAnn** » Tue Jun 27, 2006 3:25 pm

Well, sheesh. I just timed myself for how many single tongues I could do in ten seconds and it was 50 or so. That is a LOT slower than what you're complaining about. But my double and triple tongueing covers the gap nicely....and only once in orchestral music can I remember coming across a passage that tripped me up, where the double tongueing didn't work either.

Huh. BTW, playing tuba actually sped up my single tongueing on horn; having to move so much "more" tongue to get the articulation clean on tuba, musta strengthened some muscles.

Anybody have an opnion on whether tongue size affects the max tongueing speed? I remember seeing a horn player whose tongue looked like a little snake tongue, it was so skinny. My dental hygenist told me of a guy whose tongue was so big it was hard to clean his teeth.

MA, who is unsure whether it's "tongueing" or "tonguing" because neither one looks right

XtremeEuph · Post by **XtremeEuph** » Tue Jun 27, 2006 4:00 pm

MaryAnn wrote:Well, sheesh. I just timed myself for how many single tongues I could do in ten seconds and it was 50 or so. That is a LOT slower than what you're complaining about.

....actually that is close to the same

XtremeEuph · Post by **XtremeEuph** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 2:35 am

speaking of which, the piece that brought this problem to attention was morceau symphonique. ....... this is a recording of David Werden playing it .......................the 16ths honestly sound double tongued to me even though he doesn't need to. Am I just hearing things? It seems that way anyway... http://www.dwerden.com/SoundFiles/morceau.ra

XtremeEuph · Post by **XtremeEuph** » Sat Jul 22, 2006 9:34 pm

AAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(rips hair out)

TubeNet

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