Government Interference in Chicago

[dunelandmusic]

Today Chicago's aldermen and women voted to pass the "Big Box Ordinance", trying to portray themselves as an episode of "Portraits of Courage", while any thinking person can see this is simply politics as usual, gutless and spineless.
The ordinance requires retailers with 90,000 sq. ft. of space to pay a "living wage", which our esteemed councilpersons have decided is $10/hr, plus $3/hr in benefits, to be phased in over 4 years.

I consider myself a free market person, the market will generally sort the matters out by supply and demand, and the prices which go with it. On a rare occasion, government might have to intervene in a matter, but as I said, a rare occasion. These matters mostly involve the public good, and few politicians have any vision to see the public good, they only see what's good for themselves.

What's wrong with setting a wage? Everything. It's pretty easy to sit in a council meeting and play Santa Claus, handing out gifts to constituents. It's a much tougher position to actually build a store, figure costs, and make the thing actually work. Where did the figures for a living wage come from? No where !!! They are completely arbitrary, and designed to stick it to succcessful companies under the guise of helping the community. The community will not be helped here. These communities in blighted areas already pay higher prices due to lack of stores. Now they will continue to suffer from lack of stores if the Big Boxes aren't built, or the cost of the "living wage" will be passed on to consumers. End result-the community loses, either by lack of opportunities, or by higher prices.

How do you set a "living wage"? If $10 is good, wouldn't $20 be better? How about $100/hr, that would really help if we could just pass a law where everyone would earn $100/hr? Why not, we deserve it, all of us, don't we ? We work hard for the money.
We don't do it because it would kill business. Why doesn't the living wage apply to all employers? Why do we only single out large firms willing to build in depressed areas? The Field Museum doesn't pay everyone $10/hr, and I bet most of the stores on Michigan Avenue don't start people at $10/hr. If it's good for the big guys, would it be just as good for the little guys?

And the alderpersons did this, took away opportunities from poor people, while passing raises for themselves.

In other news from the council, they are about to pass an ordinace requiring all dogs to be implanted with computer chips. This supposedly will help keep people safe. This whole issue started as a discussion to ban pit bulls, which led people to say we can't ban specific breeds, and let's have enlightened thinking here. The CDC reports 60 pit bull fatalities since 1979, and 29 rottweiler fatalities. These two breeds far surpass any others in attacks and fatalities. Common sense folks can see day after day the attacks on the news involve pit bulls. Enlightened people cannot see this. When's the last time you heard of an attack by a golden retriever, or a pug?

But back to the chips. If government can decide for us that we need to implant all of our pets with computer chips, what's next? Computer tracking of all vehicles? Computer chips for newborns? The idea here is you don't know what's best for you, the government needs to tell you.

And you thought this was the land of the free.

[Doug@GT]

This is probably approaching the realm of "politics", so I have sent you a PM instead.

[dunelandmusic]

I considered that when I posted, but politics has to do more with elections, whereas this has to to do more with economics and the role of government, although I contend politics influenced the decision

[DaTubaKid]

Computer Tracking in Vehicles?

GPS?

[windshieldbug]

Let the chips fall where they may.

[windshieldbug]

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh... the keg at the end of the rainbow!

[Chuck(G)]

Chip implantation dogs has been standard in Multnomah county (OR) for a couple of years and has helped quite a bit with the stray problem. In my view, it's no different from cities requiring that you license and vaccinate your dogs.

I wonder if the issue of "safety" is really more a matter of making sure that dogs are regularly vaccinated. Getting bit by any dog is bad enough, but if you've got the worry of not knowing if the darned thing has rabies or not, it's ten times worse.

Allow me to submit a view from one who's involved in rescuing strays.

After Katrina, we got a load of "rescue" animals up here from well regulated New Orleans. As a consequence, we've had to deal with epidemics of whipworms and heartworm, with heartworm testing now a mandatory part of a vet visit.

A few years ago, there was some sort of national counterculture "anarchist" gathering south of town that left us with a parvo epidemic.

Most animal control agencies have differing standards on how long they must keep a "stray" before destroying it. Since dogs tend to lose tags, it's hard to apply differing standards to "licensed" and "unlicensed" dogs. The microchip solves that problem. It's a one-time affiar that stays good for the life of the dog. No lost hard-to-read tags.

The big boy shown below was discovered wandering around after a July 4 celebration. He had an expired cat license on his collar that traced back to a disconnected phone number. Had he been microchipped, he'dve stood a better chance of being reunited with his owners, instead of being adopted out. BTW, he's a great animal and we're happy to have him.

<img src="http://www.sydex.com/photos/NormBall_Small.jpg">

[tofu]

The original poster forgot to mention that before the city council voted for the "living wage" they gave themselves a $5,000 raise from $98,000 to $103,000/year. This in addition to a sizable expense allowance they get which is supposed to go for maintaining an office and staff but also seems to pay for what many might consider personal expenses.

Pretty hard to say no to a few dollars more for working stiffs when you give yourself a nice raise. I think this might make them the highest paid alderman in the country and this for a part-time job. Many appeared on the news to explain they work very hard. Of course it is hard to stay ahead of the federal prosecuters who have put many of their former colleagues in the slammer.

As far as the big box this will likely be turned over as unconstitutional. The unions really worked this one because of Wally Mart. They had no problem with all the Home Despots but went nuts when Wally showed up. The unions threatened alderman with running folks against them at election time and really bankrolled and whipped up the frenzy.

The sorry part of all this is that say what you will about Wally Mart the cost of milk there is half of what those in poor neighborhoods in Chicago pay if they can find it. There was a study done that found that the distance to a grocery store in the burbs was half that of the distance in a poor neighborhood in Chicago and yet the distance to get to a fast food joint was half as far in a poor neighborhood then it was in the burbs. Which contributes to making the wrong food choices.

These folks pay far more for stuff than nice areas and need jobs. Both for the money but also for their self esteem and for the chance to pull themselves up by their bootstraps. The joke of all this is that very few folks at the big box stores in Chicago make less than $10 an hour. At Wally Mart they are at $10.99 by the second year and their insurance cost is $27 a month for a family (at least according to the news).

[Rick Denney]

Minimum wage turns out to be a cynical attack on the marginal work force, rather than a benefit to the downtrodden poor. (Of course, I always wonder who's doing the treading on those downtrodden. Most of the ones I see have downtrodden themselves, or were downtrodden by their parents, friends, and neighbors).

If you have to pay $10 an hour for someone to sweep the stock-room floor, you'll probably not hire the guy who's mentally limited, but willing, who was previously getting $5.25 and glad to get it. You'll hire the guy who you can also use to stock the shelves to get your money's worth. In Chicago, he'll be a union member, and so he'll file a grievance about being told to sweep the floor, which isn't in his contract job description. Often, the floors get swept by a third-tier manager, who may make less than the stockers who laugh at him.

Workers who are willing but who have very low knowledge, skill, and experience are the ones who are first out the door when salaries are subject to an artificial floor. That, of course, is to the union's advantage--it gets rid of competition.

I want to puke every time I hear a union boss tearfully emote about his downtrodden, "workin'-man" non-union brother in support of higher minimum wages. Turns out, he's the one with the hob-nailed boots, and that marginal worker is the one with the boot-prints on his posterior.

Rick "who has seen plenty of this first-hand" Denney

[Alex F]

Sigh . . .

Where are the Wobblies when you need them . . . ???

Solidarity forever

[Doug@GT]

Minimum wage turns out to be a cynical attack on the marginal work force, rather than a benefit to the downtrodden poor.

There is a good paper of this topic here.

Doug "it's astounding because it's true"

[DBCooper]

I want to puke every time I hear a union boss tearfully emote about his downtrodden, "workin'-man" non-union brother in support of higher minimum wages. Turns out, he's the one with the hob-nailed boots, and that marginal worker is the one with the boot-prints on his posterior

None-the-less, thanks to Arturo Toscanini (among others), conductors AND patrons have looked down their noses at orchestral musicians for decades, and the union has been irreplacable for them.

[Rick Denney]

None-the-less, thanks to Arturo Toscanini (among others), conductors AND patrons have looked down their noses at orchestral musicians for decades, and the union has been irreplacable for them.

You will note that I was not arguing against unions. I was arguing against some union tactics. I have no beef with collective bargaining, when the tactics are honorable.

My complaint here was against using pretended and contrived sympathy for minimum-wage non-union workers as support for increasing the minimum wage, when the real objective is to drive those workers out of the market altogether.

I'm also astounded by the rhetoric of many union fat-cats when talking about corporate fat-cats.

Rick "who likes a balanced system, but who also likes honesty and good faith" Denney

[tofu]

I want to puke every time I hear a union boss tearfully emote about his downtrodden, "workin'-man" non-union brother in support of higher minimum wages. Turns out, he's the one with the hob-nailed boots, and that marginal worker is the one with the boot-prints on his posterior

None-the-less, thanks to Arturo Toscanini (among others), conductors AND patrons have looked down their noses at orchestral musicians for decades, and the union has been irreplacable for them.

Do symphonic musicians really believe that the patrons AND I assume you are referring to "THE PAYING CUSTOMER" really feel that the folks who "BUY" tickets look down on them?

Even if this is true -- in my business as long as a customer is paying me he can think what he wants of me.

I understand the conductor reference, but how has the union helped the patron (aka customer) with this? The unions certainly have contributed to higher ticket prices - which of course contributes to fewer folks coming to concerts - which ultimately leads to fewer orchestras and less demand for orchestral musicians.

[DBCooper]

You will note that I was not arguing against unions. I was arguing against some union tactics. I have no beef with collective bargaining, when the tactics are honorable.

My complaint here was against using pretended and contrived sympathy for minimum-wage non-union workers as support for increasing the minimum wage, when the real objective is to drive those workers out of the market altogether.

So noted. You've got the choir here. With SO many negatives being mentioned about unions, I just thought I'd mention a positive

Do symphonic musicians really believe that the patrons AND I assume you are referring to "THE PAYING CUSTOMER" really feel that the folks who "BUY" tickets look down on them?

I understand the conductor reference, but how has the union helped the patron (aka customer) with this? The unions certainly have contributed to higher ticket prices - which of course contributes to fewer folks coming to concerts - which ultimately leads to fewer orchestras and less demand for orchestral musicians.

I'm not referring to wages, I'm talking about working conditions. While the conductors have played up the fact that they are the "only" ones capable of intelligent interpretation, they continue to treat orchestras not as collaborators, but as musical children. That despite the fact that every one of them in a professional orchestra has a terminal degree or practical equivalent.

What you are implying is that such positions should be "outsourced". I hate to tell you, but it is NOT musician's salaries that are dictating the cost of ticket prices. I think that if you looked into it you would find, like in every other business, it is funding, facilities, capital expendatures, the "support staff", and the hugh salaries that Music Directors/conductors command that FAR outstrip musician salaries. Ken Lay could have EASILY been a conductor!

[MartyNeilan]

If we have burglaries taking place in a neighborhood, and the suspect is a white male, we aren't going to shake down people at random. We aren't going to be stopping black teens or Hispanic grandmothers. We are going to press the pavement for white males. WTF is wrong with polictically correct people? They have lost their minds.

[windshieldbug]

Oh great.
Now I'm hungry again

Sure...

[dunelandmusic]

Addendum to the story-the computer chips in dogs vote was postponed in order to have another hearing on the matter.

The arguments you cited about strays have been part of this debate, and the problem with pets in the wake of Katrina have also been part of the debate. I don't really care if people want to chip their pets, I just don't think it's the aldermen's decision, it should be left to the individual. They had to vote themselves a raise in this same meeting to earn more money to deal in issues that they should leave alone. If they would limit their scope of government, the would have to "work so hard".

[Chuck(G)]

The arguments you cited about strays have been part of this debate, and the problem with pets in the wake of Katrina have also been part of the debate. I don't really care if people want to chip their pets, I just don't think it's the aldermen's decision, it should be left to the individual. They had to vote themselves a raise in this same meeting to earn more money to deal in issues that they should leave alone. If they would limit their scope of government, the would have to "work so hard".

Offhand, I'd say that would be okay if animal control wasn't funded by tax dollars. But as long as the gummint (city or county) picks up strays, I suppose they get to call the shots.

Hey, if you privatized AC, you could have the animal version of the Lincoln Park Pirates (are you old enough to remember this one?):

http://lyricsplayground.com/alpha/songs ... ates.shtml

If you don't like it, you can always vote the bums out.

[MartyNeilan]

2/ Most people whose work is worth less than $5.15/hr. are teenagers or temp's. Any able-bodied person with an I.Q. of at least 80 who cannot (without subsidy nor dictate) earn at least twice that much has some serious lifestyle issues.

I respectfully disagree, unless I misunderstand your definition of "temps."
Go to any employment service in your area, and you will most likely find there are plenty of 30 day temp-to-perm jobs that require some modest degree of skill. These will most likely also be in the $7-$8 range, with a 50 cent increase once it goes permanent.
I am not including day labor places, many of them are almost as criminal as their workers. You will make less than minimum wage there once you pay your travel costs, equipment fees, and "paid today" fees.
Go to ANY retail outlet and ask for $10.30 an hour to start. They will laugh you out of the store.
In my area of the state, Dell was recently hiring "experienced PC technicians with A+ certification" for slightly less than the amount you stated.