St. Petersburg vs Miraphone

[Lee Stofer]

I would not recommend the St. Petersburg 202N to be used for any school band. The valves have been improved significantly, and I found that with about 4 hours' work in the shop, I can make one of these horns play pretty well. BUT, the instrument is still nickel-plated with no lacquer to protect the nickel, and the potential for many problems abound. And, the main reason that I would not buy them for a school band is that the bore is too large for most young students to really control, as I really believe in controlling the instrument and pitch when playing. If all of your tuba players are strapping lads/gals with huge lung capacities, then it might work, but what about the 97 lb kid who comes into band and deserves to have a chance to play well? My picks for high school tubas are, in no particular order;

-Mirafone 186
-Kanstul 5/4 tuba (4 front-pistons, .689" bore)
-King 2341
-Conn 5J
-Meinl-Weston model 25

For a rotary-valve instrument, either the Mirafone or Meinl-Weston will provide the school with quality instruments that will last, and I'd be slightly more inclined to go with the Meinl-Weston for durability reasons.

Of the three American, piston-valve options, the Kanstul instrument is by far the best player, with the tightest pistons on the planet and the only main tuning slide adjusting system I've ever tried that really works for me. And, the Kanstul is modular in construction, like the contrabasses, so they are easy to disassemble and repair. Using sturdy allen bolts through hefty brace halves, the Kanstul can be broken down into bell, body, valveset and leadpipe in just minutes without using the torch, which would likely translate into lower maintenance cost to a school over the years. A couple of band directors were really surprised to learn last year that they could buy Kanstul tubas for less than the Mirafones, but that is a result of the weak US Dollar/strong Euro. You really can buy a fine domestic horn at a good price.

Buy for the long term, and you'll save a lot over the long term.

[scottw]

"For a rotary-valve instrument, either the Mirafone or Meinl-Weston will provide the school with quality instruments that will last, and I'd be slightly more inclined to go with the Meinl-Weston for durability reasons. "

While I am not going to argue with anything you say, the one thing that would sway the decision between the Mirafone and the M-W for a school setting would be something non-musical--simply, the difference in weight between the two horns. The Mira weighs in at something around 15-16 lbs; while I don't know the exact weight of the M-W, I can say just from trying a friend's horn that it weighs a great deal more. That same 97 lb kid will be much more likely to stay with a lighter horn than a heavier one--this is just a reality of getting low-brass kids to stay with a horn.

[GC]

St. Pete compares to Miraphone like a pile of cow manure compares to a bag of processed organic fertilizer. There are uses for both and they can perform the same functions, but there are issues of wide applicability, quality control, price, and, of course, the yuck factor.

Truthfully, I like the sound of a St. Pete, but it's easy to tell the difference in construction, durability, and sound.

[chuck neidhardt]

This is a no brainer - any school which can afford 4 new Miraphones should get them, fast!

[tubaguy9]

I played a St. Pete in high school, it is definately not a good horn. all of the bad rumors are true, except that it is hard to dent (generally) it's sound is no where near as rich as a 186. and in a short time you'd have to tighten the rotor springs just to keep them moving decently fast.

I have an OLD Miraphone (being 35 years old) and the rotor springs still work great. I just can't complain about the springs of the Miraphone. I'll have to agree on the tuba choices that Lee Stofer made, being:
-Miraphone 186
-King 2341
I'll agree with those two, and don't know about the others, but I'll go with the King 2341, as that if you have a bigger guy on the instrument, the 186 will overblow easier with enough air, and cirtain mouthpieces.

[MileMarkerZero]

I agree with Lee about the Meinl-Westons...those things are built like an Abrams tank.

But if the choice is between Miraphone and St. Pete, that's a no-brainer. There is a high school here in Knoxville that bought 4 new ones from He Who Is Not To Be Mentioned about 4-5 years ago. They are falling apart. The linkage has had to be re-worked, they are beat to he!!, the slides are frozen, the valves have to be dis-assembled and thoroughly serviced at least once every 10 days or so or they lock up.

St. Petersburg vs. Miraphone? Thats like putting Jerry Lewis and George Foreman in the ring together.

[lgb&dtuba]

I agree with Lee about the Meinl-Westons...those things are built like an Abrams tank.

But if the choice is between Miraphone and St. Pete, that's a no-brainer. There is a high school here in Knoxville that bought 4 new ones from He Who Is Not To Be Mentioned about 4-5 years ago. They are falling apart. The linkage has had to be re-worked, they are beat to he!!, the slides are frozen, the valves have to be dis-assembled and thoroughly serviced at least once every 10 days or so or they lock up.

St. Petersburg vs. Miraphone? Thats like putting Jerry Lewis and George Foreman in the ring together.

A high school? Frozen slides? Beat all to hell?

I don't care anything about St. Pete's but this sounds like too hostile an environment for any tuba to fare better in.

A rotary tuba IMHO is a more delicate instrument than a piston instrument. Why anyone would subject them to high schoolers is beyond me.

I have a Sanders stencil (Cerveny) I bought new from the same source 25 years ago that is much like a St. Pete's in that it's thin and has to be handled with TLC. It's still in relatively good shape and I play it a LOT. But I wouldn't give it 6 months life in the average high school band, let alone 4-5 years.

What is the best horn for a high school seems like a whole separate topic. My take is don't let the little gorillas anywhere near a real tuba of any brand.

Jim Wagner

[Tubaguy56]

okay, I'm going to take the 3 horns I've played here and give my opinion.

the cerveny and the miraphone I went back and forth between because I couldn't decide which one I liked better.

Meinl Weston I found for a student player required too much air, and others have said that it is a "vacuum"

[Chuck(G)]

I have a Sanders stencil (Cerveny) I bought new from the same source 25 years ago that is much like a St. Pete's in that it's thin and has to be handled with TLC. It's still in relatively good shape and I play it a LOT. But I wouldn't give it 6 months life in the average high school band, let alone 4-5 years

One of the local high schools has an Amati BBb, purchased about 20 years ago. Looks almost new. That may have less to do with the construction and more to do with not being able to play it in tune at all.