Conn Constellation euphonium info ......

oldbandnerd · Post by **oldbandnerd** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 10:37 pm

Tonight I got to play a Conn Constellation bell front euphonuim . It had 4 valves ,was compensating and had a on-the fly tuning adjustment similar to a King 2280 .
The age is unknow but it was bought in a music store in Florida and the onwer then moved to Virginia .

Does anyone know anything about this model ? I did a google and found nothing .

oldbandnerd · Post by **oldbandnerd** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:04 pm

Here's what I have found . It's a 1960's era Conn Constealltion model I24 .

Here's what it looks like :

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:14 pm

So it WAS a 24I. Non-compensating, but a tune-on-the-fly main that has a spring-loaded return.

oldbandnerd · Post by **oldbandnerd** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:27 pm

What's all th tubing on the back for then ? It comes off the 4th valve and comes back around to the other side of the 4th . Not like any compensating horn I have seen where the tubing comes off the 4th and goes to the 1st . I just assumed it was compensating system .

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:35 pm

oldbandnerd wrote:What's all th tubing on the back for then ? It comes off the 4th valve and comes back around to the other side of the 4th .

All that tubing is equal to the length of the tubing on the 1st and 3rd valves. It's a 3 + 1 set-up. Nice tuning slide kicker. Never seen one of those on a 24i.

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:43 pm

oldbandnerd wrote:What's all th[e] tubing on the back for then? It comes off the 4th valve and comes back around to the other side of the 4th.

It's a normal 4th valve length... it's just wrapped so that the tuning mechanism can be mounted on something!

oldbandnerd · Post by **oldbandnerd** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 7:57 am

Thanks for the info guys .It's been very interesting to read . Now .....
What can you tell me about the mouthpiece receiver ? It looks to be a euro shank but my modern euro shank mouthpieces don't quite fit .The taper isn't big enough to seal in the receiver . The owner wants to move into a bigger cup but can't find one with a receiver that will fit . Any ideas ?

Tubanese · Post by **Tubanese** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 12:34 pm

You need a "Connstellation, 5B" mouthpiece.

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 12:40 pm

Perhaps a bass-trombone size shank will fit. Easy enough to borrow one and try.

(Thinking that what OBN said was that the shank was going too far into the receiver)

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 12:43 pm

oldbandnerd wrote:What can you tell me about the mouthpiece receiver ? It looks to be a euro shank but my modern euro shank mouthpieces don't quite fit .The taper isn't big enough to seal in the receiver . The owner wants to move into a bigger cup but can't find one with a receiver that will fit . Any ideas ?

Old American bariphoneums had small receivers that fit a tenor trombone shank. The Euro receiver is larger, and the modern standard received fits a bass trombone shank, which is larger still.

Try a Wick 4AY. It was made for the Yamaha 321, which has a tenor trombone receiver like the old American baritones.

By the way, "compensating" is a general term that includes the use of a tuning trigger. "Automatic compensation" is what euphoniums with the Blaikley system have. Most have forgotten this distinction, but you can claim to have remembered it.

Rick "noting that this was the standard professional euphonium in America before the Marine Band started using the Besson" Denney

oldbandnerd · Post by **oldbandnerd** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 5:55 pm

It's not that the receiver is too short or the shank is the wrong size. The shank tapers much wider then any modern mouthpiece to fit the receiver .

On another related topic : Do these horns have any value as a collectable item ? Does the owner have $100,000 horn or a $ 200 horn ?

Chuck(G) · Post by **Chuck(G)** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 6:41 pm

oldbandnerd wrote:On another related topic : Do these horns have any value as a collectable item ? Does the owner have $100,000 horn or a $ 200 horn ?

They're sought after by geezers who remember playing them. $500-$1000 might be a fair price for one in excellent condition, given the right phase of the moon and the relative humidity.

I don't think that they play any better than modern instruments, but the short-stroke valves do make it unusual.

YMMV

RyanMcGeorge · Post by **RyanMcGeorge** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 12:42 pm

It's probably an old remington shank. I don't know much about them, but I do know that some of the Conn trombones from that era had them. It's similar to a euro shank but it's different with the taper or something, I'm not really sure.

Teubonium · Post by **Teubonium** » Fri Dec 15, 2006 1:33 pm

TubaTinker wrote: All that tubing is equal to the length of the tubing on the 1st and 3rd valves. It's a 3 + 1 set-up. Nice tuning slide kicker. Never seen one of those on a 24i.

Hopefully, the 4th valve tubing is slightly longer than 1 and 3 combined.

This is NOT a 3+1 setup, 3+1 means the 4th valve is not located with the other 3 and is operated with the left hand.

dwerden · Post by **dwerden** » Sat Dec 16, 2006 9:40 pm

I thought the Conn Constellation was a pretty nice horn. It certainly won't sound as big as a modern compensating euphonium, but it had a very nice sound nonetheless. And the tuning slide trigger was a few decades ahead of the Sterling and Besson.

When Denis Winter was first in The U.S. Coast Guard Band with me he played one of these and it worked very well for him. I believe that is what Henry Charles Smith plays as well.

I wouldn't mind having one in addition to my other horns (assuming I were richer and had a bigger house, of course). It might be a great choice for certain pieces.