One of "those" questions...

djwesp · Post by **djwesp** » Fri Mar 09, 2007 7:45 pm

So, I have been offered 100 dollars to remove the laquer from an instrument.

I've never been one to turn down such an offer.(poor, older college kids rarely turn down money making schemes.) What's the best way to do this? The instrument in question is a newer trumpet.

This question will open the floor for the laquer/raw brass debate, which I apologize for in advance. However, what is the best way to remove this laquer and then, the best substance cleaning/patina forming chemical to use afterwards? What kind of protection can be afforded a raw brass instrument?

Tubadork · Post by **Tubadork** » Fri Mar 09, 2007 7:55 pm

Aircraft brand stripper,
as far as patina, no idea
Bill
BTW
when did part of Nebraska belong to Arkansas?

djwesp · Post by **djwesp** » Fri Mar 09, 2007 7:57 pm

Tubadork wrote: when did part of Nebraska belong to Arkansas?

Never, that I can recall.

My location was formerly Arkansas. I left that state for a much flatter, colder one. Full of just about as many rednecks.

trseaman · Post by **trseaman** » Fri Mar 09, 2007 8:19 pm

djwesp,

I was going to ask you... So since we're talking about NEB and ARK and rednecks! Where are you located now and where were you located in ARK? I've got some family in northern NEB and family all over NW ARK & SW MO... So, I moved to OK because there are no rednecks out here!!!

Okay everybody you can stop laughing anytime now!!!

Tim

trseaman · Post by **trseaman** » Fri Mar 09, 2007 8:42 pm

Oops,

Back on topic! I forgot to mention that I used a paint stripper when prepping my upright bell for silver plating. It didn't quite remove it all so I tried CLR and to my suprise it finished the job nicely! Go figure...

Tim

Pure Sound · Post by **Pure Sound** » Fri Mar 09, 2007 8:44 pm

I've heard Naval Jelly used to strip paint off of ships works pretty well

bububassboner · Post by **bububassboner** » Fri Mar 09, 2007 9:09 pm

Would CLR work as the starting remover instead of just for touch ups?

Chuck(G) · Post by **Chuck(G)** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 12:12 am

If you want a patina, this stuff is pretty good:

...and if it's that 60's orange "lacquer" from a King horn, I wouldn't do it for $100.

djwesp · Post by **djwesp** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 12:31 am

Chuck(G) wrote: ...and if it's that 60's orange "lacquer" from a King horn, I wouldn't do it for $100.

Bach.

Chuck(G) · Post by **Chuck(G)** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 12:48 am

djwesp wrote:Bach.

Go down to your local auto-parts store and ask for "aircraft stripper". The stuff will pull paint off of a car in nothing flat; some wimply lacquer on of a Bach horn is nothing. Wear stripping gloves and eye protection.

Tom · Post by **Tom** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 12:56 am

What about using easy-off oven cleaner?

That stuff seems to make it's way through almost anything in my experience. It's cheap and easy to use too, but I've never tried to strip lacquer with it. Comments?

Patina wise, I would personally get it all cleaned up, polish it nicely, and then let it tarnish naturally (doesn't really take that long). That JAX stuff isn't bad if you want that brown patina right away.

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 1:12 am

Tom wrote:What about using easy-off oven cleaner?

Easy-Off is a caustic product. It will work on the orange King lacquer but not on most other lacquers. Try Aircraft Stripper first. If that doesn't work, then you might try the oven cleaner.... but be warned... after using caustic you're going to have to buff your *** off to get rid of the black that it leaves behind.

greatk82 · Post by **greatk82** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 11:42 am

("Somebody open up a window!")

Tom · Post by **Tom** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 2:39 pm

TubaTinker wrote:
Tom wrote:What about using easy-off oven cleaner?
Easy-Off is a caustic product. It will work on the orange King lacquer but not on most other lacquers. Try Aircraft Stripper first. If that doesn't work, then you might try the oven cleaner.... but be warned... after using caustic you're going to have to buff your *** off to get rid of the black that it leaves behind.

Good to know.

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 3:54 pm

tuben wrote:....We would coat every inch of exposed skin with the spray Deep-Woods-Off. After a few shows I noticed the lacquer where my right arm rested on the bell looked funny, kind of scaly like a fish. I scratched it with my thumbnail and viola, the lacquer flaked right off and only left the bare brass below. No black gunk, no residue, nothing. .....

According to the MSDS, Deep Woods 'OFF' contains 30-60% (by weight) Ethanol. I had a similar experience a few years back where I was wearing a bunch of Mardi Gras beads and OFF at the same time. The OFF darned near disolved the beads and made a heck of mess on my T-shirt. Off will also mar the surface of things like watch crystals and cell phones. There may be something else besides Ethanol in there, though.... Ethanol is just alcohol and it doesn't seem to me that that should cause problems with lacquer.

djwesp · Post by **djwesp** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 6:41 pm

trseaman wrote:djwesp,

I was going to ask you... So since we're talking about NEB and ARK and rednecks! Where are you located now and where were you located in ARK? I've got some family in northern NEB and family all over NW ARK & SW MO... So, I moved to OK because there are no rednecks out here!!!

Okay everybody you can stop laughing anytime now!!!

Tim

Central Nebraska now.

Was raised in North Central Arkansas in a Retirement town full of people from Chicago (Mountain Home, Arkansas). Which is the trout capital of the world (Cotter) and is surrounded by the Bull Shoals Lake, Lake Norfork, White River, and the Buffalo River. You literally can't get in without crossing some body of water. It is a beautiful area of the country. (pic below from my drive home from school)

Pretty Scenic for a town and area as big as it is (about 40,000 in the county-- about three hours from the nearest legitimate airport) and about 2 miles from the Missouri Border (about 45 miles from West Plains, Missouri and about an hour and a half from Branson, Missouri). I'd love to still live there, but it takes forever to get anywhere. The roads in and out of the place are 45 MPH and as curvy as heck.

Then went to college at Arkansas Tech University in Russellville, about an hour away from Little Rock/ 40 minutes from Conway, Arkansas.

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 7:10 pm

Scooby Tuba wrote:
TubaTinker wrote:I had a similar experience a few years back where I was wearing a bunch of Mardi Gras beads and OFF at the same time.
I just want know what you did for the ladies to garner all those beads!!!

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 7:13 pm

Oh.... by-the-way.... IF you plan to strip a horn AND are planning to do any disassembly work or soldering.... strip the horn BEFORE applying any heat to the horn. Most all lacquers are a real bear to get off after it is heated to the point of discoloring.

djwesp · Post by **djwesp** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 7:19 pm

TubaTinker wrote:Oh.... by-the-way.... IF you plan to strip a horn AND are planning to do any disassembly work or soldering.... strip the horn BEFORE applying any heat to the horn. Most all lacquers are a real bear to get off after it is heated to the point of discoloring.

Here's what I was going to do.

1. Remove all wear items on the horn. Felts, corks, valves, etc.

2. Clean the horn out really well with boiling water, removing all water, humidity, chunks of crud with compressed air.

3. Test the remover on spot between second and third valve (where it won't be seen).

4. Remove all slides, individually remove coating. Then remove coating from remaining instrument.

5. Cleaning the horn with hot water and calcium carbonate after the removal.

6. Drying and buffing the horn, removing all the black. Using a buff pad on a speed variable dremel and a hand buffer to remove from hard to reach places.

7. Apply Jax.

Does that sound okay?

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:19 pm

djwesp wrote:
TubaTinker wrote:Oh.... by-the-way.... IF you plan to strip a horn AND are planning to do any disassembly work or soldering.... strip the horn BEFORE applying any heat to the horn.

Here's what I was going to do. ......Cleaning the horn with hot water and calcium carbonate......

I've heard of calcium carbonate (whiting) and alcohol being used to clean satin silver finishes but I'm not sure what purpose it would serve to clean a raw brass horn. Please elaborate.