Are people changing?

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Chuck(G)
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Are people changing?

Post by Chuck(G) »

I buried a dog today--she was in her 11th year and wonderful companion. Metastatic lung cancer.

This isn't the first time I've buried a Golden Retriever with lung cancer. It sort of goes with the breed--you've got about a 7 of 10 chance of losing a Golden to some kind of cancer. We adopt unwanted dogs, so it's all part of the game.

But it's not the dog or her fate that really bothers me. She was a good girl right up to the end.

About 10 years ago, another dog I owned got sick the same way. The cancer progresses pretty quickly, but most dogs are eager to keep doing familiar things. Mariah (the first dog) would go out for a walk with the other dogs, but be unable to get all the way home on her own. So I'd carry her as far as I could, rest and then continue. It's not easy carrying an 80 lb. dog uphill, but I can do it.

When carrying Mariah, about every other car or truck would stop and ask if I could use any help. I usually accepted a lift with the dog up the hill.

Well, Goldie, the subject dog of this weekend, exhibited the same behavior and--I ended carrying her home also. Now, mind you this was on a Sunday morning. No one stopped and offered to help Not one single person, although there was probably two or three times as much traffic on the road as there was a decade ago.

The difference in the people is that my rural neighborhood has become gentrified--lots of McMansions filled with people who are all but invisible. No waves from cars, stopping to chat or even a neighborhood potluck.

Let me reiterate that this is not a city neighborhood--folks live fairly far apart. What gives? Are our noveau riche folks that mean-spirited or are they just scared? As if an old man with a sick dog is a threat?

Anyone have any answers? Should I stop picking up trash along the roadside and stopping to help people who look lost? Is this now an "FU" society?

BTW, on a dark night at about 12 am this past autumn, I heard a big crash down on the main road. Some woman in a new Lexus had run off the road and plowed over a power distribution box and was now stuck on the remnants and in the soft mud in the roadside ditch. She managed to just clear the box and probably trip the breaker so it was okay.

I asked if she'd like to come up to the house and make a call. Instead of talking to me, she kept dialing her cell, which, of course said No Service (not unusual out here). Clearly, she was afraid of me, so I told her to stay put and I'd run back up to the house and call the sheriff. As soon as I started off, she got out of her car, with her high heels, furs, and two Pekingese in tow and started hiking down a pitch-black side road. I ran back to the house and called the sheriff. I went down to the main road and flagged his car down and told him that he'd better find the woman before she fell into a ditch or into a ravine. He found her about 200 yards away.

What is the matter with people?

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Post by Dan Schultz »

I'm sorry to hear about 'Goldie'. I met that dog last fall when Terri and I visited you and she was indeed a 'good old girl'.

I've lost two golden Labs in the last 15 years to cancerous growths. Also a Bassett about two years ago. I always just figured it was from being smack between GE Plastics and ALCOA and nestled in the center of an array of coal-burning powerplants. I'm sure we've got lots more polution here in the Midwest than you have in Eugene.
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Post by SRanney »

Doc wrote:Chuck,

People are idiots. People are insanely selfish. People suck. Stick with dogs.

Doc
Word.

Sorry about your pooch.
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Post by pulseczar »

Sorry to hear about your dog. May she rest in peace.


We now live in a world filled with rapists and lawsuits behind every corner. That's my cynical point of view.
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Post by SplatterTone »

It probably depends on where you live. A week ago Sunday, I drove the the metropolis (not!) of Welch, OK to get a 6-month old Chesapeake Bay Retriever. I had written the address down wrong and was off by two blocks. But two different people I came across knew who I wanted to see. One pointed me in the right direction and the other walked a half block to point right at the house.

Heck! I don't know who lives two blocks away in my neighborhood.

Move to Welch, OK. I'll bet you can see the Milky Way at night too.
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Post by windshieldbug »

Chuck,

I'm sorry to hear about your companion.

As far as people go, here in the Northeast, I thought it was much the same. Philly has had 104 murders by April 1, outpacing even New York and L.A. (the Angeles kind).

Even though I worked in Delaware, I had resisted moving here. Once you cross the Mason-Dixon line, the drawls are amazing.

But now that I'm here, I find that the people are spectacular in our neighborhood. People know each other, wave, and last 4th of July we had an impromptu cook-out; not planned at all, but the WHOLE neighborhood ended up on someone's back porch, people said, "Salad? Well we should have enough, just a minute... ". It's a turn-over neoghborhood, so lots of young kids that PLAY TOGETHER. Made me feel creepy at first. Kinda Stepford. That, and as Woody Allen said, "How can you breathe air THAT YOU CAN'T EVEN SEE!?"

So go figure. Just when I feel that life sucks, something like this happens...
Instead of talking to your plants, if you yelled at them would they still grow, but only to be troubled and insecure?
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Post by Wes Krygsman »

Sorry to hear about your dog, the dog that I grew up with passed away 2 years ago and I still miss him very much. Dogs truly are man's best friend.

As for the people, I have a theory that seems to be more and more true everyday. I am one of the few 22 year olds without a cell phone, a rarity. That's not the only technology that I have rejected. Here's why...people don't know how to talk to each other face to face anymore, in real life situations because of the technology. I'd rather die than become one of them.

When I first got a computer with internet capabilities, I spent hours a day instant messaging on AOL and finally after about a year of all that wasted time, I finally realized that I had been missing out on actually seeing my friends rather than seeing a screen name. So I got outside again and would go over my friends' houses. The sad part is when I would go to some friends, they couldn't leave their instant messaging even when I was there. I have noticed this more with cell phones...

I work in a busy restaurant, and obviously see many people coming in and out. It's amazing to see how many "parties" come in and don't say a word to each other almost the whole time because they are on the cell phone. I watched a couple walk in both on phones with other people and I sat them. The whole time they were there, they were talking on the phone or text messaging, I don't think they said one word to each other, or to their poor server for that matter. That is one example of many. It is even worse when there are more people being seated together, 4 or 5 people on a phone and not talking to each other.

Another example is when I'm driving and hit traffic, I look around in the cars around me. I see cars filled with people, all on cell phones, not saying a word to each other.

What is the point of ever leaving the house if you don't want to interact with any other humans? People would rather play with their technological toys and speak into a computer chip than look someone in the eye and it makes me sick.

I'm a people person, have always been pretty outgoing, and the amount of people like me is diminishing rapidly.

As for neighbors and such, I think globalization has killed localism. We have the world at our finger tips with the internet, that makes us uninterested in our neighbors. In my neighborhood, when we first moved in I was in kindergarten. We knew almost all neighbors within a 2 block radius, and all were invited to family and friend gatherings at my house. Slowly those neighbors moved out (neighborhood going downhill), and new neighbors moved in. When the new neighbors moved in, my family and I would try to extend a welcome of some sort, even if it was just a hello, nice to meet you type thing. Very not personable. Most don't even wave to say hello, even after we do. Just stare like we are crazy.

I used to shovel almost the whole block out, and without getting any money or order to do so. I have finally woken up to the fact that I'm being way too nice for people that couldn't care less if I lived or died. Last month, I helped my neighbor shovel out his car during the last northeast storm and he didn't even say thank you afterwards.

To summarize, the world is changing, mainly our little friendly neighborhoods are not at all friendly anymore, and I think technology is to blame. While there are rapists, murderers, thieves, muggers, and sick people, we shouldn't be afraid of each other. If you value the "old fashioned" ways (being nice shouldn't be old fashioned), make an effort, you'll have to try harder than ever to get people to realize that there are still good people.

Sorry for such a long post. We have touched on a topic that I am very passionate about. My generation is messing up big time and I feel almost powerless. Hopefully someone will read this and take action.
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Post by iiipopes »

Dad occasionally went quail hunting. So we had an English Setter named Lady. After Dad died, we kept her until she died at the ripe old age of 17, and we buried her in her favorite shady spot in her pen. We could never bear to get rid of her, because she was "one of the family," and reminded us of Dad.

After Dad died, Lady exhibited much of the same grieving as we did. As I grew, and the more I started to look like Dad, the more Lady came out of her long term, well, depression, until she was a very happy dog just before she died.

Because my appreciation for hunting dogs developed as a child and teenager, hunting dogs today can sense that about me and when I chance to meet one in public the dog will come over and heel beside me automatically without prompting or command. This even happened to me in a pub in Cambridge, England, with a Golden Retriever!

If I had the time and facilities, I would have a hunting dog for a pet even now. As a general statement that I believe is true, they are so loyal. But maybe in time.

The point being, I sympathize, empathize, and understand completely.
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Post by Rick Denney »

Most people buying McMansions in the exurbs are living a fantasy. They have no idea what living in the country requires, but they have this built-up fantasy of what it must be. Most of them want seclusion and to be left alone. They are city people, and grow up appreciating the anonymity that city people afford each other in order to stay sane. They try to live in the country without knowing how to be self-sufficient and without knowing how to depend on their neighbors. They pull into their shell when they should accept help, and they don't know how to offer help when they see the need. For many of them, they learned in places where being too friendly caused trouble.

They also don't know how to buy houses, preferring grandness to practicality. Grandness to me is nobody being able to see my (NON-McMansion) from the road.

You can tell a city person moving into the country--the first thing they do is install security lights all over their house. They are afraid of the dark.

Country folks, on the other hand, are sometimes friendly to a fault. I don't always have time for that conversation with the neighbor that stretches from 5 minutes to an hour.

There's a happy medium in there somewhere.

I would have offered you a ride (soon after moving out here, I helped my neighbor deliver a baby donkey, which I hope to never do again). But I might have been reticent about coming into your house to phone the sheriff, especially if I was a woman.

Sorry to hear about your dog. Our pets expect so little and give so much.

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Post by Chuck(G) »

Thanks for your condolences, guys.

I figure that maybe some folks are just plain afraid of everything. Our McMansion neighbors have security systems and we don't bother to lock the door when we leave. Some of the old-timers in the area are left and would give you the shirts off their backs without thinking.

I'm left with our two other dogs, Norman, a light-color show Golden of uncertain age (I'm guessing from his eyes that he's about 8 ) and 6-year old Nani, who's a cross of something with something else. Norm's a beautiful dog, but he's like Fabio--bred for looks and not brains. Nani's sharp as a tack, but is a perpetual puppy--she's not pack leader material. Goldie was the matron; she'd be the first to bark at something and the first to greet you at the door.. But sporting dogs are like that. I may look for another dog to join the pack, but I'm in no hurry.
-----
This business of the city folks reminds me of something that happened about 4 years ago when the new ritzy developments were going in around here. One of our dogs at the time was a really bright fellow named Rusty (show below). Surgery for a respiratory problem left him unable to bark, but he was game as ever.

I'd taken the dogs to look after a neighbor's home while he was on vacation (collect the mail, feed the dog, water the garden etc.) and I took Rusty and his two companions with me (about 1.5 miles each way). On the way back, I noted that I'd lost Rusty somewhere, so I retraced my steps. No Rusty I took the other dogs home and came back to look for him while there was still some light left.

I found him mired up to his middle in mud in a bank of rushes on one of my ponds. Since he couldn't bark, he couldn't let me know where he was and he couldn't free himself either--and being in the rushes, he was nearly invisible.

I managed to haul him out without trapping myself in mud and headed off for home with him in tow. There we were, him about half-black with mud, and me not looking much better. On the way home, I found an empty vodka bottle someone had tossed on the roadway, so I grabbed it before someone smashed it.

Just as we're coming up the road to my house, we're met by a shiny new Mercedes and a new white Jag, with immaculately groomed people inside. They actually swerved to the other side of the road to avoid us, staring wide-eyed at this dirty old dog and the dirty man carrying a liquor bottle waving happily at them....

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Post by Leland »

Wes Krygsman wrote:Here's why...people don't know how to talk to each other face to face anymore, ....

While there are rapists, murderers, thieves, muggers, and sick people,...
Take away that face-to-face interaction, and the only view of society you're left with is full of rapists, murderers, thieves, muggers, molesters, and hundreds of other kinds of bad people.

I was walking down Bourbon Street a couple New Year's Eves ago, and if anybody bumped into me accidentally (not unusual at all, of course), they immediately turned and apologized to me. It seems like it was courtesy, but I heard an undercurrent of fear every time. To me, that also means that there are people out there who will go ballistic if some stranger in a densely-packed crowd gets nudged against their shoulder.

Sorry, I don't know where I was going with that one...
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Post by Leland »

Chuck(G) wrote:Just as we're coming up the road to my house, we're met by a shiny new Mercedes and a new white Jag, with immaculately groomed people inside. They actually swerved to the other side of the road to avoid us, staring wide-eyed at this dirty old dog and the dirty man carrying a liquor bottle waving happily at them....
Okay, in that case, their nervousness was understandable... :lol:
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Post by tbn.al »

Saw a bumper sticker the other day on a pickup in the parking lot at the supermarket. "THE MORE I SEE OF SOME PEOPLE, THE BETTER I LIKE MY DOG". The only inhabitant of the truck was a gorgeous Irish Setter. I wish I could find me a sticker like that. Dog was nice too, but I am pretty attached to my dachshund.
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Post by SplatterTone »

Why the hεll did you move out of the city...??!?
So you could start breeding dogs, of course.
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Post by Dylan King »

I feel for your loss my friend. My dog "Zappa" has been miraculously cured of cancer due to fervent prayer and God's intervention on two occasions, and has been blessed with many more years than were expected. She has cancer again and is quite old, and it may now be her time. She is a wonderful pet and I will miss her very much when she finally leaves this earth in everlasting sleep (as animals do not have the potential for eternal life as human beings do).

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As far as your question is concerned, it is a good one and can be answered by a man named Paul who lived almost 2,000 years ago. The short answer from me is that it's a sign of the times. Paul says this about today's age...

Perilous Times and Perilous Men

2 Timothy 3:1 But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3 unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, 4 traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away! 6 For of this sort are those who creep into households and make captives of gullible women loaded down with sins, led away by various lusts, 7 always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. 8 Now as Jannes and Jambres resisted Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, disapproved concerning the faith; 9 but they will progress no further, for their folly will be manifest to all, as theirs also was.

Only God can reveal the truth about this world through the Revelator, Jesus Christ, who is coming soon to set up His kingdom here on earth. May that time come quickly for in the Day of the LORD peace will be on the earth, and God will rule forever in His law of righteousness.

Much love,

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Post by lgb&dtuba »

Jared wrote: Jared "still feeling a little funny talking on my cell phone with a handsfree ear piece in public" r.
As well you should :twisted:

But I'll resist going off on this.

No, I won't.

It's bad enough when so many people were all chatting on the cell phone in public, but when you politely try to acknowledge someone who you think was talking to you and get glared at because they are actually using a handsfree you cannot see there's a problem.

It used to be the local wino talking to himself. Now it's every other person walking down the street or through the mall.

Chuck, you wonder why people don't seem to have that sense of community they used to (in some places)? Look no further than the cell phone. Chit-chatting on the cell phone is the modern day "privacy bubble". Nothing says "leave me alone" like a cell phone in the ear.
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Post by pulseczar »

Don't forget about the ominous iPod. Why listen to the world when you can listen to your own music?
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Post by Wes Krygsman »

Jared,
You seem to have it in check and very nice retort (why don't you say it to my face...lol). I know that I said technology is to blame, but I meant what you said...people's abuse of technology is to blame. It's the people, not the object.
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Post by Rick Denney »

bloke wrote:OK...
I still have my satellite. I didn't move to the country to escape anything, except neighborhood nazis. We still watch TV, and the satellite is about the only way we can see more than two channels.

There's a difference between work lights and security lights. Work lights are there so you can see to work, even if it's dark. Security lights are there so that burglars can easily find the easiest ways to get into the house. Work lights are high and shine down, while most security lights are low and shine up. I really think they are there mostly so that the proletariat can see and admire the ruling-class starter castle at night. Farms have work lights; starter castles have security lights.

I'm particularly amused by lights with motion detectors. New folks in the country have no idea just how many moving things there are out there. My neighbor's light comes on every time a deer walks by, or every time I drive down our shared driveway.

In the country, the number of internal combustion cylinders often matches your age.

But we still drive into town for social contact. Might be different if'n we had kids. The redhead in particular enjoys the casual social contact of the coffee shop, etc. But we aren't talking about going into the city. We are 60 miles from DC, and the ONLY time we go there is when job duties demand it. I prefer going to Baltimore if I need big-city services, because DC basically doesn't have any. Our excursions to town take us basically a dozen miles to the nearest county seat.

One downside to the exurbanites from the city is that they don't know that country folks need services at the same price that provide 10X. Thus, we end up having to do a lot ourselves, because the prices are driven up so much we can't afford them. For example, we needed some tree work done. In some parts of the country, you can hire a tree crew for $500 a day. Our emergency tree work cost us $4400 for two days of work--and that was the "farm package" pricing. But we could not get the equipment to grind up 20" logs (they were pine--no good for firewood), nor do I have the skills to fell tall trees in sections so that they don't destroy so many other things on the way down.

The big mistake folks make who move to the country is that they continue to define their lives inside their house. They are afraid of the outdoors. When we moved, our lives more and more moved outside the house. But sometimes the fear is justified--emergency services take far longer in the country, and have fewer resources when they do get there.

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Post by Rick Denney »

Richard Brown wrote:I hear you!!! This New Rural Gentry(nerg's?) go thru life thinking themselves the center of the universe and constantly model their lives after TV commercials(life imitating art?).
Rich, I think you are misunderstanding your new neighbors. Yes, they have cultivated a fantasy of country life, but most of them either give up and move back to the city, pay extraordinary sums to others to do their country stuff for them, or they learn how to do it themselves. Traditional old-country landed gentry have always been in the second category, even those who have lived on their estates for centuries.

Yes, new exurbanites are afraid of the dark. That's understandable--they have no experience with it in the country. Dark places in cities really are dangerous. They often have no skills in maintaining the equipment needed in the country. But then they spend their dollars with the folks who already lived there to provide those services, and those folks often need that money.

I have not noticed that city people are any less moral than country people. I have frequently observed that country folks are more like Mr. Haney (on Green Acres) than Eddie Albert's character. Folks in the country have to be on their guard as much as folks in the city, but to protect themselves from different kinds of charlatans.

I've also noticed that country folks really enjoy putting city folks in their place, which is not a really charitable response to the sin of being insular. The notion that country folks are by nature friendlier does not hold up. They are definitely nosier, and do not necessarily use the personal information they discover charitably. City folks are insular, but mostly because they don't understand the country social customs.

City folk learn to maintain a space around them, and country folk don't. When I went to Texas A&M, I found myself acutely uncomfortable in many pedestrian situations because the rural students around me didn't know how to maintain a clear zone. I never had that problem, say, in a crowded high-school hallway in the big city. Many country folk respond to the reticence of city folk by assuming they are stuck up, when in fact those city folk just haven't developed that particular set of social skills. Country folk are at least as likely to have a big chip on their shoulder about it, in my experience.

In short, folks who move to the country are bringing different patterns of living with them. Those patterns are not worse, they just evolved in a different environment with different requirements. You may be amused by them, but it's wrong to be offended by them, at least at first.

Rick "thinking a lot of local natives would be impoverished but for those over-dependant exurbanites" Denney
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