Two questions

[SplatterTone]

There was the recent cartoon of tuba players as they imagine themselves and how others see them. Along that same line of thought, I have suspected for a while now that there is the implicitly known, but not explicitly defined, checklist of questions tuba players have for evaluating good tuba sound and performance; and then there is the well known and well defined checklist everyone else uses.

My suspicion was confirmed tonight. I was detained at work, so I hurried home, grabbed the 3/4 Chinese horn, and took it to rehearsal. The 191 has been laying the foundation for long enough that people should be accustomed to hearing that instead the weenie 3/4 horn. This is not a large group: 2 tbones, 1 euph, 1 trumpet, 1 horn, 2 or 3 flutes, 1 or 2 oboes, a clarinet, so the tuba does not get lost in a huge crowd to the point of irrelevance.

After rehearsal, I asked about the difference between the 5/4 and 3/4. Now, to you and me, the difference is huge. But to everyone else ... not much. A tuba is a tuba is a tuba. You save up your money. You buy your big dream tuba. You knock yourself out finding the perfect mouthpiece. You cultivate that big, smooth sound. And what do you get?

Two questions:
1. Is tuba person playing in tune?
2. Is it too loud?

That's it. Nothing else matters. Whether you are playing your $30,000 Yamayork, or your $850 Chinese peashooter, the only thing that matters to the rest of the world are those two questions.

Pearls before swine, I tell ya. Save your money. Buy Chinese.

[windshieldbug]

I have just one question:

Are the other performers even listening, or just hanging on for dear life?

[Chuck(G)]

Pretty much spot on.

About the only time that anyone notices something different is if I bring in the big York to play. WIth a 22" bell it just looks impressive. Otherwise, key, rotary or piston, size, makes no nevermind to those not sitting in my chair.

[SplatterTone]

Are the other performers even listening

That's the thing: Two school band directors. The trumpet and one bone have been playing in a local big band style group for years. This isn't a group of dufuses. The euph player, having played tuba, noticed. But that's it. And this isn't the first group where I got the feeling that as long as I brought in some kind of tuba shaped object, it made no difference to anybody what the tuba shaped object was exactly. The difference between the 3/4 and the 5/4 to you and me is huge. But to everyone else .... PFFFFT!

[tbn.al]

iT MATTERS! It matters a bunch to me. The tuba in our symphony sometimes sneaks in with something other than his PT6 and I may not notice until I try to tune to it. That B&S is the easiest to lock on to I have ever had the pleasure of playing with. I bitch at him so much when it is missing that he never brings the Conn or Miraphone any more. Bass trombone players notice.

[lgb&dtuba]

iT MATTERS! It matters a bunch to me. The tuba in our symphony sometimes sneaks in with something other than his PT6 and I may not notice until I try to tune to it. That B&S is the easiest to lock on to I have ever had the pleasure of playing with. I bitch at him so much when it is missing that he never brings the Conn or Miraphone any more. Bass trombone players notice.

I thought we were all supposed to tune to the trumpets.

[Dan Schultz]

.... Two questions:
1. Is tuba person playing in tune?
2. Is it too loud?

That's it. Nothing else matters. ....

Oh, I think even the untrained, tone-deaf, and just plain stupid folks can tell the difference... they just don't know how to explain it.

[windshieldbug]

Well, be honest- would you notice if the trumpet playet brought a student Bundy, but played it well?

[The Big Ben]

Well, be honest- would you notice if the trumpet playet brought a student Bundy, but played it well?

Well, probably no. I have an Ambassador trumpet (with a big smash in the bell crook) that plays amazingly well. Would someone notice if a top line Bach was played poorly? I think so....

I'm joining a community band (the fun kind- 'picnic in the park-band in the gazebo' concert band with high school band music and no strings) in about a month and I hope I'm ready (been practicing a lot and getting a lot out of my weekly lessons). I don't think trading in my King 1140 for a Meinl-YorkHirschaha HB-anything will make much difference in my sound. I wish it was that easy 'cause I have the money to blow on a new horn but, right now, the only thing that will help my sound is hours of practice. Anyhow, I really don't know what kind of horn I should buy because I don't really know what kind of playing I'm gonna do because, frankly, I can barely play the horn I gots. For me, the King works *fine*. And, yeah, I'm learning to play it in tune for all the notes I'm going to use. I'm getting notes out of the horn and can play scales and tunes by ear and do fairly well. It's those damn BBb fingerings and that damn bass clef.

BTW: The concert band is gloriously happy to have *any* tuba.

Jeff

[KevinMadden]

.... Two questions:
1. Is tuba person playing in tune?
2. Is it too loud?

That's it. Nothing else matters. ....

Oh, I think even the untrained, tone-deaf, and just plain stupid folks can tell the difference... they just don't know how to explain it.

I's agree with that, when I was buying my YM, the only person who came with me to Dillons was my then girlfriend (and oboe player) I asked her which sound she liked more as I went from YM to cerveny and back and forth. she told me she liked the YM more but didn't know why"...the sound was... well... just... um ...better"

[Chuck(G)]

I's agree with that, when I was buying my YM, the only person who came with me to Dillons was my then girlfriend (and oboe player) I asked her which sound she liked more as I went from YM to cerveny and back and forth. she told me she liked the YM more but didn't know why"...the sound was... well... just... um ...better"

Yup, but you had to ask her and make her think about it. Most people never bother to notice--the tuba player's the guy that always seems to be doing something whenever the bass trombonist picks up his horn...

...unless the work being played calls for the tuba player to use a mute--and then the tuba player's just plain fun to watch.

[tbn.al]

DO WE spend that extra $8000 ONLY to impress the bass trombone player?

This bass trombone player is not easily impressed, but he sure is appreciative when somebody else spends the extra $8000 to make his life easier. My tuba and bass trombone together didn't cost $8000. Thank goodness my tuba buddy is an investment banker and can afford to have such a nice horn. He plays good too.

[SplatterTone]

DO WE spend that extra $8000 ONLY to impress the bass trombone player?

It's to attract the tuba groupies. The unfortunate side effect of one tuba player to many groupies is:

was my then girlfriend

It's a burden we have to bear.

[Chuck(G)]

Do you notice what kind of equipment the guys in the double-bass section are using? (Quick, how many use German bows, how many use French? Of those, how many are graphite, fiberglass or wood? What color hair is on the aforementioned bows? How many of the basses have C extensions? Are any five-string? What material are the adjusters on the bridge for each made of? Does anyone of them play a laminated bass? )

We are so vain sometimes...

[SplatterTone]

Do you notice what kind of equipment the guys in the double-bass section are using?

I do notice how many times they can spin the bass around between slaps. That's something, by gum.

We are so vain sometimes...

Deservedly so.

[iiipopes]

In Shrine band and a couple of other places I play occasionally, my Besson was just fine. But in the university community concert band, the director never liked it, although I was in tune, in tone, and on top of the part. So when my Besson started leaking and the solder joints deteriorating, I purchased another tuba to please him instead of just getting the Besson overhauled. For now, I've taped up the leaky joints and keep it at the Shrine band closet. But I will overhaul the Besson eventually, because it is so much fun to play. Almost as much fun as a Conn 14k souzy. So knowing I'll be playing outdoors as well as indoors, I got the old Miraphone with the detachable bell, with both upright and recording bells fitted.

[Rick Denney]

I don't buy tubas to impress other members of the band.

(I did notice, and felt it glowed in the dark, when our principle horn player bought an Alexander to replace his Conn 8D. But I don't notice the other instrument choices.)

The tubas I've bought impressed me. Since I play for fun, the fun a particular instrument brings to me counts.

And I can hear the difference.

Most folks, in an appropriate large room, can hear the difference between various sizes of horns in an A-B test. They can hear the difference when they are out front. But maybe they don't notice as much when they are also playing.

Although, Mike Sanders reports that when he switched to the Yorkbrunner, several in the viola section stopped playing and turned around to see what was different.

Rick "who doesn't care what the trumpet player plays, but who does benefit from the care the trumpet player exerts on his choices--okay, bad example" Denney

[iiipopes]

Yes, but it begs the question: does the tubist notice any of the violists? (Not that the tubist would want to, unless (from my perspective, if I was still single) she was really cute.

[MaryAnn]

I do remember when Mark Nelson came to play tuba for an orchestra concert. After the first short place we played, a lot of the orchestra turned around and said something like "Wow, Tuba player!" And then, of course, the conductor asked him to please tone it down a little (because he had just blown most of the orchestra right out of the rehearsal room.)

I found that very, very funny. But I don't remember whether he had his CC or his F, although I presume it was the CC. So...they hear the sound, but I think they associate the sound with the player and not the instrument per se.

MA