Valves. Valves. Valves.

[Chuck(G)]

I think it's the problem of quality:

Rotory valve horns has a minimum price of $2000

But piston valves can be in every price.

So the 'sticky pistons' are always cheap.

Have you ever heard of a Meinl Weston piston sticks?

Any piston can be made to stick with the addition of gunk or a foreign body, as can any rotary valve.

Rotary valves are actually cheaper and easier to manufacture than pistons. Consider:

1. All rotary valves on a tuba are basically the same unit; i.e. they're interchangeable. So instead of making 2 or 3 different designs (as on a piston horn), you need only make one. (Exception granted for graduated-bore instruments.)
2. The amount of hand fitting and brazing on a piston is greater. Consider that the "knuckles" on both are hand-fitted and brazed, but that the ports in pistons must be fitted and brazed also.
3. The whole valve assembly is more complicated to assemble in a piston-valved instrument., as it must be hard-brazed together, while in a rotary instrument, the indiividual valves are usually fitted together using nothing more than soft-soldered ferrules.

There's no coincidence that the St. Petersburg and most of the Chinese tubas are rotary-valved, not piston.

[Leland]

I got hold of a set of new Melton levers and fitted them to my F. The results are staggeringly good

That kinda of reminds me of the Tim Allen standup routine where he talks about modifying his grandma's recliner -- "I was thinkin' that that chair moved a little slow, and I could make it faster. So, I got some o' them heavy duty springs for a Ford F-150, wedged those suckers in place of the wimpy stock La-Z-Boy springs, and boy, that chair snaps right to attention! Ar ar ar..."

But, seriously, changing the levers seems like a good idea. It's like how I changed the suspension on my car -- just because the horn came with certain levers doesn't mean that it can't use different ones.

[Leland]

Now what I want to know is where do we attach a turbo

Heh... right in the leadpipe, of course...

[Leland]

In the leadpipe, powered by the tailpipe!!! My God the power
Finally a recycleable use for Tuba players farts, of course I never fart

LOL...

gives a new application for the turbo's blow-off valve...

[Leland]

Why bother? More bang for the buck with a turbo... lol

[imperialbari]

Please, couldn't we just gently slide us our way out of these valve discussions?

[Leland]

No, no no no...

To continue the turbo analogy, the mouthpiece is effectively the intake manifold & injectors. You can't put the turbo after the intake manifold.

To turbocharge playing with a tuba, you'll have to put a hole in your cheeks (or chest or neck) and run the turbine's airflow through there.

Then, if you're running boost pressures anything above "medium-low", you run into the problem of blowing charged air through lips that were designed only for pressures that the chest can produce. Just like modifying an engine's injectors, crankshaft, rods, pistons, and whatnot, you'd have to modify your lips to accommodate the extra air pressure.

[Leland]

Then, you'll either:

A) Fall asleep;

2) Freeze your lips;

D) Play a half step flat.

[Leland]

Probably not -- it would just make your airstream more dense (along with becoming cold as hell).

[ThomasDodd]

No, no no no...

To continue the turbo analogy, the mouthpiece is effectively the intake manifold & injectors. You can't put the turbo after the intake manifold.

I'd call the mouthpiece the carb, and the lead pipe the manifold. Remember a brass horn is old technology. So look before computer controlled, multiport fuel injection, and CD distributoeless ignition.

Putting the system between the carb and manifold, and pulling more air in works. So do the same on the tuba. It'll suck the air out of you lungs, past the lips (the fuel) and into the horn.

Only problem I see is the disturbance of the air flow that would cause.

[Leland]

Airflow post-buzz wouldn't give any benefits other than blowing the spit further around the horn.

We don't really blow into the instrument to make sound -- we buzz our lips to make sound, and the instrument just amplifies & colors the buzz. If it were somehow physically possible to send the buzz to the horn without sending the airflow (even though that's surely impossible), you'd still get a sound.

The intent should be to increase the buzz, and that can't happen if the increased wind isn't coming through the lips.

A quick, nonpermanent turbine solution would have the turbine inside the mouth, with an intake tube drawing air through one corner of the lips and the exhaust blowing towards the inside of the lips. Or, maybe you could run the intake tube up the sinus passage to draw air through the nose.

[Leland]

Maybe we'd need to find out what Sony used for their trumpet-playing robot.

Beef up that system and you can have a robot play loud enough to knock down walls.. lol

[ThomasDodd]

Airflow post-buzz wouldn't give any benefits other than blowing the spit further around the horn.

My commets would increase the airflow through the lips.

We don't really blow into the instrument to make sound -- we buzz our lips to make sound, and the instrument just amplifies & colors the buzz. If it were somehow physically possible to send the buzz to the horn without sending the airflow (even though that's surely impossible), you'd still get a sound.

Fast air is for support right?

And more air can increase the amplitude of the vibration, thus the loudness of the sound.

Forced induction would give faster air, and allow increased amplitude. The muscles in the lips would still controll the amplitude, though it would be harder to play quiet. Some control on the amount of boost is probably needed.

As to super charger or turbo charger, remember a turbo charge is a super charger. the turbo just limits the driving power source. I don't think a turbo would work well, since there not enough exhaust flow to drive it.

[Leland]

Now, all we have to do is find an air compressor that compresses silently...

Maybe, but the other thing we need to find is a player who'll let us shove a tube down his nose.

Remember, he'll have to pose for pictures, too.

[Leland]

You would, huh?

Weirdo...