Alternate fingerings...

Richardrichard9 · Post by **Richardrichard9** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 1:17 pm

I have a wierd trill that I can't get on my tuba with the regular fingerings.. it goes as such..
(in the mid range, an octave above low, not pedel Bb)

B Natural (quatrernote) A natural then a trill from the a natural up to b natural.

I can't get it with 2 and then 1 and 2

MartyNeilan · Post by **MartyNeilan** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 1:36 pm

It won't be perfectly in tune, but you could try 13 for the A and 3 for the B natural - simply trilling the 1st valve.
If you need to hold out the A momentarily at the beginning of the trill, start it as 2 to establish the pitch, then move to 3 for the B, then down to 13 for the A, up to 3 for the B, etc.

Richardrichard9 · Post by **Richardrichard9** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 8:38 pm

oh ok thanks.. that may work..

Todd S. Malicoate · Post by **Todd S. Malicoate** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 9:52 pm

1-3 to 3...if you can pull your first valve slide a bit it will improve the intonation on the A played 1-3.

The trick with difficult trills is to try and get the two pitches of the trill on the same partial if possible. This always makes the trill more natural sounding, and you will find it much easier to execute.

Richardrichard9 · Post by **Richardrichard9** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 10:10 pm

no it isn't because of finger dexterity. I Don't why it is but I can't get it up to the B natural with the normal fingerings. but when I did the 1-3 to 3 as suggested it worked great. It is a fast trill and is over in a dotted 8th note in 4/4 when quarter note=84

eupher61 · Post by **eupher61** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 11:33 pm

1) what key is your tuba?

2) hopefully you're talking about the bottom of the staff A/B, is that correct?

Richardrichard9 · Post by **Richardrichard9** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 11:53 pm

My tuba is BBb, I am talking about an octave above low Bb. so 1st space and 2nd line on the staff.

eupher61 · Post by **eupher61** » Sun Oct 14, 2007 1:01 pm

MartyNeilan wrote:It won't be perfectly in tune, but you could try 13 for the A and 3 for the B natural - simply trilling the 1st valve.
If you need to hold out the A momentarily at the beginning of the trill, start it as 2 to establish the pitch, then move to 3 for the B, then down to 13 for the A, up to 3 for the B, etc.

listen to Marty...

iiipopes · Post by **iiipopes** » Sun Oct 14, 2007 1:35 pm

Of course, it is understandable that you're having difficulty. You're trying to trill from the 4th partial A nat with 2nd valve to 5th partial B nat with 12, so you're both going from an even partial to an odd partial, and adding tubing as you go up, making it even more difficult.

Now, after we've vented the frustration by shooting the composer, I agree that 1-3 to 3 might work because you're both subtracting tubing for the higher note and staying in the same partial range for the two notes: 3 as the alternate fingering for 12, and adding 1 to 3 lowers the pitch a whole step in the same partial series. And if it's a trill, pitch from using the alternate fingering may not be the issue, as even though 1-3 combinations tend to be sharp, the 5th partials, in this case A nat, tends to be flat, so they counter each other. Actually, depending on how far you have 3 pulled for 2-3 or other combinations, it's the B nat that might be a little flat, but since it's the upper note of the trill, it probably won't be noticable, especially since you will be naturally giving it a little more air and lipping up to make a good "edge" on the trill.

I also thought about 2-4 to 4, but again, you're compounding the problem by trying to add tubing while going up, which is the same difficulty with 2 to 1-2.

Richardrichard9 · Post by **Richardrichard9** » Sun Oct 14, 2007 4:25 pm

Ok thanks for all your help!

I wish I did know who the composer was, but it is an all county audition, so I don't know the name of the piece or anything. I only have an excerpt on a piece of paper. The way the piece is written (and sounds, very classical, with very very long 16th note passages with little chances to breathe) I think it was actually originally written for Double bass.

iiipopes · Post by **iiipopes** » Sun Oct 14, 2007 5:05 pm

Well, it might or might not be for double bass, depending on how high it appears to go, and whether it was transposed down the octave to concert pitch for your tuba tryout. (Symphonic double bass reads an octave higher than it sounds. That's why it's called a double bass.) But since it is much easier for a cello or double bass to trill A nat to B nat, it very well could be.

eupher61 · Post by **eupher61** » Sun Oct 14, 2007 7:00 pm

um...maybe because the bass viol doubled the cello???

Richardrichard9 · Post by **Richardrichard9** » Tue Oct 16, 2007 3:49 pm

iiipopes wrote:Well, it might or might not be for double bass, depending on how high it appears to go, and whether it was transposed down the octave to concert pitch for your tuba tryout. (Symphonic double bass reads an octave higher than it sounds. That's why it's called a double bass.) But since it is much easier for a cello or double bass to trill A nat to B nat, it very well could be.

Because of the way it sounds (very vivaldi like) my teacher and I both think that it was written for some string instrument. It doesn't have any bowings or anything. But if it was written for tuba, then the composer didn't know much about the tuba.