DVORAK Symphony No. 8

[Chuck Jackson]

don't know why you need to bring Mahler into this debate. Dvorák's music is pleasant and enjoyable, but to myself and I expect a lot of other listeners, lacks much depth of feeling. In contrast, Mahler's music explores the reaches of every human emotion.

For pleasant background music I will enjoy Dvorák, but for a really moving experience Mahler wins hands down every time - and as this a is a tuba forum, there cannot be many orchestral tubists who would rather be playing Dvorák than Mahler

Rolling Eyes

Well, having played my share of both as a professional musician and having to sit through tacet movements, I find that my attention was drawn away from my book/magazine/crossword puzzle/trying to get the attention of the hot cello player in front of me more by Dvorak than Mahler. Matter of taste. Not that I don't admire Mahler, with the exception of Das Leid von der Erde as recorded by Klemperer/Philharmonia, I don't seek it out.

My opinion, you are welcome to yours.

BTW, what do you do for a living? I want your job because, obviously, you are making a ton more money than me. I think I am in the wrong line of work!!!!

Chuck "cheers" Jackson

[TexTuba]

My professors told me so!

Back when I was in college, a couple of my professors told me that by the year 2000 or so, we might all be dead from the coming ice age. I always beleived what my professors said without question. Not!

My professors told me I wouldn't have any trouble getting a job with a music ed degree!

That is quite true here in Texas from what I've seen. All of the music ed. majors I've known here got jobs right off the bat. Maybe you should come to Texas!

As far as the original topic, I love the music of Dvorak. We're getting ready to play "Te Deum Laudamus" in orchestra with the choir. It's not really interesting for tuba, but it sure is fun to hear what the rest of the group is playing!

Ralph

[MartyNeilan]

Back when I was in college, a couple of my professors told me that by the year 2000 or so, we might all be dead from the coming ice age. I always beleived what my professors said without question. Not!

My professors told me I wouldn't have any trouble getting a job with a music ed degree!

That is quite true here in Texas from what I've seen. All of the music ed. majors I've known here got jobs right off the bat. Maybe you should come to Texas!

Texas was actually one of the few places it was suggested (by several people) that I do not go to pursue a music ed job unless:
A) I was from Texas
B) I graduated from a college in Texas
Right now, I am in an area that is saturated with musicians and music wannabees, but is consistently cutting back on arts education.

[windshieldbug]

Just for the record, I met my (still) wife on tour in Portugal playing among other things, From The New World, so Dvorak will ALWAYS have a special place in my heart.

[jeopardymaster]

This is quite a thread. My one observation, in light of comments comparing Dvorak's work to that of a composition student, is to pass along a Sam Green story.

CCM, where Sam taught, required incoming Freshman brass performance majors to play a diagnostic jury in front of the entire brass faculty. A certain trombonist came in and played the ever-living snot out of a tough solo (I can't remember which). The trombone teacher leaned over to Sam and whispered "Jeez, what am I supposed to do with a kid like that?"

Sam said - "study with him!"

Compared to what a lot of comp professors are publishing these days, I'd have to say Dvorak holds up pretty well. I'll shut up now.

[Wyvern]

My opinion, you are welcome to yours.

BTW, what do you do for a living? I want your job because, obviously, you are making a ton more money than me. I think I am in the wrong line of work!!!!

Chuck "cheers" Jackson

I will go with that - it would be a boring world if we all liked the same things.

For my living, after 26 years working up to be a senior manager in a London company, I am now self employed as a Management Consultant - plus any freelance tuba playing I can get (predictably 95+% of my income comes from the former )

Cheers,
Jonathan

[Dean E]

This is one of my favorite pieces of music, period. If you are going to do it, DON'T TAKE A BOOK! Just sit back and listen.
As said already, it is glorious....even when there is no tuba part!

If you love this symphony like I do, you will be glad to know there is a brass quintet arrangement available!! No strings, no woodwinds, just brass - and the tuba part is A LOT more interesting!! You can find it on my website www.dorm40music.com or through sites like BVD Press, Robert King or Solid Brass Music. You can hear the 3rd movement performed by the Triton Brass on their MySpace page:

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fu ... d=54924497

Jobey Wilson on tuba. Great playing, Jobey!!

I accepted the gig and have a copy of the music.

The most technically difficult part looks like the first note, a ppp G nat, 4th space below the staff, without being warmed up. Fortunately, that note is very sweet to play on my horn, and if I slip in a little late trying to slot the note, such is life.

Thanks for all the offers and insights, everyone.

[Craig Garner]

Hey guys!!! Dean is back (he's the one who started this post with a very simple question - what's the tuba part like for Dvorak 8?) Thank you Dean for answering the question yourself: it's not hard!!!

I wonder, Dean, if you will ever post a simple question again?

[Chuck Jackson]

I hope that I am keeping Chuck entertained. Someone has to. (Poor man, hanging around here with a bunch of tuba players.)

You don't know how much I wish I could still play so I could count myself in your company. As much fun as conducting and teaching is, I miss the boys in back the most.

I am hoping that the boy doesn't PM me.

Chuck

[Mojo workin']

Since Elephant insists on having everyone suffer through what has become a personal argument between the two of us, I can't let his continued hypocritical condescension go unanswered. So this is what I had sent him in the PM-

Quote:
Just drop it, man.



Is this not an effort to shoosh me?


Quote:
parroting the opinions of your professors.




Quote:
My professors told me so!



compared with


Quote:
Shostakovich and Bruckner in particular being looked at as the 'red haired stepchildren' amongst composers, to the composition student/professor circles. What does that say about those who have FAR more education than you think I have?




It seems to me that you missed my point. I was implying that some great composers in my eyes such as Shostakovich and Bruckner were not given as much respect or importance as they deserved at my school(s). Meaning that I would take less stock in what they say, thereby refuting your impudent attempt to insult me.


Quote:
your observations are a matter of taste and opinion



No crap. When did I claim otherwise?


Quote:
BTW, mojo, my demeanor in this exchange was brought on by your choice to come into a nice thread about a perfectly good piece of music that was being spoken of in an admiring manner by several of us, and choosing to call the taste of all of us into question by "educating" all of us on how stupid it has to be to like such a piece, written by such a minor talent as Dvorak.



I merely stated an opinion. I called no one stupid, all the while realized that everything that I have said of Dvorak is a matter of opinion.

Your demeanor in this exchange is a somewhat common one for you. You seem to seek a very agressive and authoritative status on this list with quite a few people, I've noticed. If Mojo is attempting to sound erudite, then Elephant is calling people down more than he should. After all of your insults, I still must admit that I have been impressed with your knowledge of things music and tuba related. My original post didn't warrant my education being insulted. Nor do I think my education is so much better and higher than everyone else's by simply responding to an implication that I must not be very educated.

Phil Taylor aka Mojo Workin'

And now you want to hide behind PMs?

I hide from nothing. Especially you in your overzealous critiques of what you think people are implying.

He is bad. It is a proven fact that he writes like a student," is just stupid. And that is what you are saying.

Again, claptrap. Symphony #8 was the piece called into question that is student level writing in my (shout it from the rooftops) OPINION.

An inability to recognize that you did so is a sign of a poorly digested education.

Thanks to tubenet, I have the arteest known as The Elephant as my Milk of Magnesia.


"Hey tubenet, Mojo Workin' PM'd me trying to clarify something rather than 'Put it in the thread where it belongs'!"

I am suddenly reminded of the taddle tale from my fifth grade class.

[Mark]

Since Elephant insists on having everyone suffer through what has become a personal argument between the two of us, I can't let his continued hypocritical condescension go unanswered.

You got to know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em,
Know when to walk away and know when to run.

So Mojo, do you like Kenny Rogers?

[Mojo workin']

So Mojo, do you like Kenny Rogers?

No, I think his songs are beginning composition student level writing. This is a known fact that I along with my music theory and composition professors have tested and determined to be 99.9% true.

The other .1% was a passage in one of his songs that sounded hauntingly like Mahler.

[windshieldbug]

Kenny Rogers' symphonies are held by many to be far inferior to Dvorak's! (and his tuba parts are even less satisfying... )

[KiwiTuba]

The challenging part will be sitting through an over-rated work with beginning composition student level writing.

Whenever I used to say things like that about the pieces we were playing, one of my trombonist colleagues used to say to me, "we're all still waiting for Allely's Symphony no. 1"

[The Jackson]

Someone call?

[Biggs]

Proof that Dvorak was brilliant:

His best-known work involves very little tuba playing.

Proof that Dvorak was clueless:

He vacationed in Iowa.



I still think he's pretty ok.

[Mark]

John Williams

Here are the facts:

1) John Williams is stinkin' rich. This is because average people voted with their dollars.

2) Ask the average person on the street to name a living composer and they will respond "the guy who wrote the Star Wars music".

Here are the conclusions based on these facts:

1) There is no way any self respecting classical musician can respect anyone who is loved or even just liked by the unclean masses.

2) Williams copied the music from Arlen.

Here is my opinion notwithstanding the facts:

1) John Williams is the greatest composer living today.

[Chuck Jackson]

1) John Williams is the greatest composer living today.

Don't know if he is the greatest, but I daresay he is the smartest. He got other people, including dead people, to do his work for him. That's what I call a job.

Chuck

[windshieldbug]

Without a doubt the smartest.

He knows what to look for
where to look for it
and how to use it.

All things in common with JS Bach, and look where it got him!

[Chuck Jackson]

All things in common with JS Bach, and look where it got him!

True, very true. But at least Bach stole, mainly, from himself.

Chuck