flat horn

Kendra · Post by **Kendra** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 8:59 pm

I have a puzzling question for you all (at least it is for me)...

I have a student whose euphonium (Yamaha compensating... not sure what model) is REALLY flat!! She is a very good player (All-State musician) and in the middle of a rehearsal noticed that all of a sudden her horn was really flat. I played it last night at her lesson and sure enough, it was REALLY out of tune. I was playing a tuning Bb (just above the staff) and it was 30 cents flat (main tuning slide was all the way pushed in). I played all the way up a high Bb and all the way down to a pedal Bb and it was consistently flat (except for a few notes, which were extremely sharp). The ONLY note that was in tune (with the slide pushed all the way in) was a high Bb.

I told her to take her horn home and clean it, so she did... and still very flat (nothing changed). In my 20 years of playing euphonium and 15 years of teaching (both privately and at a public school), I've never run across this problem. I am very puzzled.

So... does anyone have any suggestions?

brianggilbert · Post by **brianggilbert** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:06 pm

Could it be a bad mouthpiece pairing?

Kendra · Post by **Kendra** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:09 pm

I thought that too, but when I played it with my m.p., it had the same issue.

My student also played my euph (Hirsbrunner Exclusive) with her m.p. and was in tune.

So, no... I don't believe that's the issue...

TubaRay · Post by **TubaRay** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:46 pm

I would check for possible leaks, especially the water key(s).

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 11:50 pm

Aw, c'mon, there it was; low, slow, and over the plate!

andrew the tuba player · Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:24 am

How about this one?

jhedrick · Post by **jhedrick** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 9:29 am

Stop Stop - Oh the tubanity!! I can't bear the carnage!

Were either of those horns "teacher approved"?

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 10:44 am

jhedrick wrote:Were either of those horns "teacher approved"?

Only by flat teachers.

van · Post by **van** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 10:58 am

I recently bought that horn at the auction site for $10.50 (plus shipping, of course) and it really looks "sharp" on my living room wall.

The Jackson · Post by **The Jackson** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 11:02 am

William Parlier wrote:
jhedrick wrote:Stop Stop - Oh the tubanity!! I can't bear the carnage!

Were either of those horns "teacher approved"?
Okay, I'm just curious. What in the world is in your avatar?

Dewd, it's the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

Alex C · Post by **Alex C** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 11:15 am

In my experience a leak would normally cause the pitch to go sharp. Since it seemed to happen suddenly, I would suggest that you check that the valves weren't actually switched.

A euphonium player I know actually played a Yamaha with switched valves for several years AND was enrolled in the studio of a well-known euphonium teacher. It isn't as obvious as you'd think.

jbaylies · Post by **jbaylies** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 11:15 am

The Jackson wrote:
William Parlier wrote:
jhedrick wrote:Stop Stop - Oh the tubanity!! I can't bear the carnage!

Were either of those horns "teacher approved"?
Okay, I'm just curious. What in the world is in your avatar?
Dewd, it's the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_spagetti_monster

MaryAnn · Post by **MaryAnn** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 11:42 am

If it was a sudden change, which is what it sounds like....she has to go back to "just before" the change and figure out what happened with the horn. Switched valves sounds plausible to me.....could be, or something else similar. Did anyone have opportunity to play a trick on her? Would anyone do that? Switch parts with another euphonium whose parts happen to fit hers? Blockage in the receiver that keeps the mouthpiece from going all the way in?

MA

Chris Smith · Post by **Chris Smith** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 12:14 pm

everyone sides you willie

Dean E · Post by **Dean E** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:13 pm

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:27 pm

I had no intention of throwing this actually valuable thread off-track, but since I apparently have,

<img src="http://www.travelerstuba.com/travelersclub021019.jpg" width="250">

andrew the tuba player · Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:30 pm

congradulations you've just sent me into spiraling depression...kinda like the 20J........but not quite as bad.

Dean E · Post by **Dean E** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:34 pm

Kendra wrote:I have a puzzling question for you all (at least it is for me)...

I have a student whose euphonium (Yamaha compensating... not sure what model) is REALLY flat!! She is a very good player (All-State musician) and in the middle of a rehearsal noticed that all of a sudden her horn was really flat. I played it last night at her lesson and sure enough, it was REALLY out of tune. I was playing a tuning Bb (just above the staff) and it was 30 cents flat (main tuning slide was all the way pushed in). I played all the way up a high Bb and all the way down to a pedal Bb and it was consistently flat (except for a few notes, which were extremely sharp). The ONLY note that was in tune (with the slide pushed all the way in) was a high Bb.
. . . .
So... does anyone have any suggestions?

That's a puzzle for sure. I can only think of some remote things to rule out:

1. Valve slides may have been switched. Possible, but not likely. There would be visible differences.

2. Double check the tuner for calibration at A=440. It's possible to accidentally turn on and reset some tuners while in a carry bag.

3. An object may be wedged in the smaller tubing. I bought a used horn which had a plastic bottle of valve oil wedged in the tubing. Flushing with water didn't come close to doing the trick. It took days to free it up.

Good luck with your investigation.

andrew the tuba player · Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:50 pm

This happened to my 20J come to think of it. It had a bag full of red markers

took me days to get the stane out of the tub. But, luckily it just fell out.

So, you may check this. I've also seen this with
a trumpet and a trombone

.
Also, does your Euphonium have plastic valve guides? Our Holton does and they can easily be rotated when oiling the valves. this has happpened to both our euphonium and marching baritone and a tuba at band camp. It can rotate enough that the horn willl no longer play. So, just something to check.

jhedrick · Post by **jhedrick** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 3:34 pm

William Parlier wrote:
jhedrick wrote:Stop Stop - Oh the tubanity!! I can't bear the carnage!

Were either of those horns "teacher approved"?
Okay, I'm just curious. What in the world is in your avatar?

Why, that's the Flying Spaghetti Monster see:http://www.venganza.org/

Make sure to read why the lack of pirates is causing global warming.

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