Another Chapped Lips Question...

MileMarkerZero · Post by **MileMarkerZero** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:54 am

All you EVER wanted to know about camphor...

http://www.inchem.org/documents/pims/ph ... :1.%20NAME

oldbandnerd · Post by **oldbandnerd** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 7:01 am

....2.3 Diagnosis
Poisoning by camphor is associated with an initial excitatory
phase, with vomiting, diarrhoea and excitement, followed by NS
depression and death. A characteristic odour of camphor is
present on the breath.

...... nasty .....

Tubaryan12 · Post by **Tubaryan12** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 7:07 am

MileMarkerZero wrote:All you EVER wanted to know about camphor...

http://www.inchem.org/documents/pims/ph ... :1.%20NAME

lol. That's the site where the toxicology numbers I quoted were from. Thanks for pulling that up.

oldbandnerd wrote:
....2.3 Diagnosis
Poisoning by camphor is associated with an initial excitatory
phase, with vomiting, diarrhoea and excitement, followed by NS
depression and death. A characteristic odour of camphor is
present on the breath.
...... nasty .....

sure, if you want to EAT the stuff.....lol

Ironically, these are the symptoms from drinking too much water:

Fatigue, Lightheadedness,Weakness,Cramping,Weight gain,Nausea,Bloating and/or swelling,Dizziness,Headache,Confusion,Fainting,Disorientation,Seizures (severe cases),Coma (severe cases), and in the case this past year of the woman in California trying to win the Wii during a radio contest: death.

Be carefull out there.

Thanks guys, I just realized this thread pushed me over 1000 post! yay me!

Roger Lewis · Post by **Roger Lewis** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 9:58 am

Nutrogena lip balm - only available in drug stores. I put it on before bed and right after playing. It works for me. I personally didn't like the Chop Savers but it is a good product.

If your chops are really bad, get a bottle of Vitamin E (alpha Tochoferol) gel caps and cut one open with a pair of scissors before going to be and smear it on. When you wake up in the morning your chops will feel like iron. It's oil of wheat germ and I believe that it is good for you. It smells a little weird, but you get used to it.

Roger

Toobist · Post by **Toobist** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:48 am

Nobody (I don't think) is trying to say that any lip balm is going to kill us. Camphor effects the nerves through the skin by numbing them short-term and even long-term through extended use. As tubists, I'm sure we all understand the need for nerves around the lip area.

I normally use plain vitamin E gel when I absolutely need it... in emergency situations only. I seldomly use it, but if I wake up the morning of a gig with chapped lips, I can usually heydrate them sufficiently with one or two applications. Chopsaver is becoming a favourite as well.

There is a tendancy for some of us to become too reliant on topical ointments for our lips. Eventually our lips won't hydrate themselves as efficiently as they would have had they been left to fend for themselves with just the water we drink.

There was a statement above that I use with my own students: "If your pee is yellow, you should drink more water." This is especially useful during this time of year (in my climate anyhow), when the furnaces start pumping.

With the heat on during the winter, if we don't use a humidifier, there is a much better chance that we're gonna wake up with the ol' crusty lips. If you have a cold or allergies and find yourself breathing through your mouth primarily, the chances are that much greater.

My advice:
1) Drink lots of water. I promise... none of us has the time involved in drinking so much that it'll kill us.
2) Use balms that do not include camphor. (I find menthol has similar numbing qualities as well.) I used Chopsaver this morning after a long night of mouth-breathing due to a cold.
3) Use balms only when you feel that familiar dry sensation before your lips are truly chapped or when they are chapped. To make it a habit may lead to a dependancy on such products.
4) Look into a personal humidifier for the bedroom. Check the box for the square footage that it'll cover before purchasing to be sure it pumps out enough H2O for your bedroom.
5) See number 1.

Tubaryan12 · Post by **Tubaryan12** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:56 am

Toobist wrote:3) Use balms only when you feel that familiar dry sensation before your lips are truly chapped or when they are chapped. To make it a habit may lead to a dependancy on such products.

The best advice given so far.

ken k · Post by **ken k** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 3:56 pm

You know the grease that forms on your forehead and sides of your nose? rub it off on your finger and apply it to your lips. (seriously, but only when no one is watching....)
natures moisturizer....
I also use ChopSaver. Also drinking some more water will help hydrate from the inside.
ken k

jbaylies · Post by **jbaylies** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:09 pm

Thanks everyone for all the help, sadly though it's still happening, the playing for an hour and going right back to where I started, I'll keep on trying, though.

Also, no one's answered this yet:

I'm also curious about a story I heard about a trombone player who used vaseline while he played! Would that help me? Doesn't it clog up the instrument?

Anyone?

Toobist · Post by **Toobist** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:23 pm

Vaseline is good for sealing in moisture in, if your lips are already hydrated, but I'd be warey of the dependancy issue. Vaseline is not great for your valves and your horn's other innards should you blow any of it into it. If you're using vaseline or any other goopy or waxy product, we sure to at least wipe your lips clean before you play. Otherwise, cheese may quickly form in your horn... well at least more quickly than usual.

If it makes you feel any better, this past weekend I developed very chapped lips. They were noticably chapped - red and sore. I drank lots of water and applied Chopsaver (though Vitamin E or most of the products listed above would do) for the last few days. They are still chapped but far less so than a couple days ago. Take heart, our lips will be better very soon. At least I can play with relative security now.

The weather has been changing erratically and we had a snow storm here in the Toronto area. I and many others have experienced similar lip problems. Take heart! Our lips will be better very soon (I'm guessing mine'll be right as rain tomorrow.), as long as we stick to the practice of drinking lots and lots of water and applying helpful products to our lips. Then... of course... we keep drinking lots of water to maintain their hydration and lay off the balms until we really need them.

Toobist · Post by **Toobist** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:26 pm

I just read the post above regarding the use of your natural oils like those on your forehead. That's good advice too. I've done that in a pinch when my vitamin E wasn't available and I was nowhere near a drugstore. I agree that it should be done discreetly...

Greg Bright · Post by **Greg Bright** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:25 pm

As a USPS Letter Carrier I can speak to the dependency issue. I use DCT approximately 12 times a day. On the rare days when I accidentally leave it at home I come near panic. Especially if its cold, windy, sunny, cloudy, rainy, warm, or snowy.

But it did get me through this year's TC in Indy.

pierso20 · Post by **pierso20** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:40 pm

I am surprised noone has mentioned this, but maybe it is only a problem I have had.

What mouthpiece are you using?????? Sometimes, if you have some sort of allergy to a metal or alloy in the metal, the chapped lips could be part of a reaction. I was using a MP at one point (can't remember what is was) and I had the same problems...NOTHING solved my lips....UNTIL I got a new mouthpiece.

Just give it a try. Try something gold plated, or something that is stainless steel.

Good Luck.

iiipopes · Post by **iiipopes** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 7:23 pm

Yes, regardless of what type of material you prefer for your mouthpiece, make sure it's clean, smooth, free from scratches, pocks, dents, etc., that will let the underlying raw brass (if a plated piece) touch your lips, and/or let any discontinuity in the surface be a potential for rubbing a raw or blistered spot on your embouchure. It's bad enough for an irritation or injury to heal indoors in controlled climate, but for it to happen with weather extremes makes it geometrically worse.

jbaylies · Post by **jbaylies** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:52 pm

pierso20 wrote:What mouthpiece are you using??????

I use an LM-7. Surgical grade stainless steel, no problems there. My lips are slowly getting better, though. I haven't played since I posted this and last night I covered them with a bandage to keep the DCT from drying off. Now it's just red with a little dent where a cut is healing, hopefully it'll be healed on friday 'cause the quintet I'm in has a gig at a bank. It'll be my first time getting paid!

oldbandnerd · Post by **oldbandnerd** » Sat Jan 12, 2008 6:30 pm

I have been playing now for just over 4 years. I have been battleing with the same lip problems as the original poster . My lips never heal . Unless I just quite playing .
I have been using a stainless steel mouthpiece for about 2 years now . That has help a lot but never completely solved the problem .
After reading this thread I gave up the lip balm I was using .It contained the Camphor . I started using a beeswax based one with peppemint and vitamin E . I have also started putting vitamin E on my lips at night . It has worked for me . I have actually had entire days where I didn't need anything. Still not a complete cure but a vast improvement over what it was before .
Thanks guys !!

brianggilbert · Post by **brianggilbert** » Sat Jan 12, 2008 6:55 pm

To be honest, I was a tried and true Blistex OINTMENT guy forever whenever I wasn't in the sun (no SPF in it).

Recently, I've found that Burt's Bees Beeswax works better for me. It also is a bit neater in appearance - it doesn't look like you've just eaten a powdered doughnut...

ken k · Post by **ken k** » Sat Jan 12, 2008 10:50 pm

Aveeno Active Naturals Essential Moisture lip conditioner with spf 15 (How's that for a title?) is a nice lip balm which I have been using this winter and it seems to have a natural feel to it.

the label says "with natural oatmeal, jojoba oil and shea butter"
of course under ingredients it reads "Dimethicone, 1.0%, Octinoxate, 7.5%, Oxybenzone, 5% ...."

but seriously I have had good results from thsi ointment this winter. they also have a medicated ointment which I have used in the evenigns before bed when the lips were first very dry and cracked.

I have also been making a point of drinnking a half mug of water between every lesson throughout the day, so that I stay hydrated.

ken k

Matt Reese · Post by **Matt Reese** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 12:45 am

brianggilbert wrote:
Recently, I've found that Burt's Bees Beeswax works better for me. It also is a bit neater in appearance - it doesn't look like you've just eaten a powdered doughnut...

I also have found that Burt's Bees is some of the best stuff around. I like the fact that it is mostly natural (I think around 90%) Great stuff, I totally recommend it.

jbaylies · Post by **jbaylies** » Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:13 pm

They are finally just about healed!
I used Blistex DCT all the time, every day, and at night I put a bandage over it to keep the stuff from coming off. I also found that I can play with the Blistex on and it will not hurt the tuba, so now I'm trying to get back in shape in time for All-State auditions.

Lots o' long tones.

Thanks, everyone!

TubeNet

Another Chapped Lips Question...

My personal preference is....

different idea

Re: different idea

Thanks!