Worst thing about horns you own (or have owned)

SplatterTone · Post by **SplatterTone** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 3:18 am

BriceT wrote:Miraphone 1291: can't really complain about playing, but the brass is very thin and it is easily dentable

I'll second that. Close examination of my bell shows multiple indentations where my knuckles press against the bell when I pick up the horn. I try to avoid it, but the brain is not always focused. Even the slides are easily dented. My main tuning slide shows a very slight depression where the water key snagged on my pants leg as I was lifting the horn, and the slide dropped about two feet onto carpet. This is definitely not a school horn.

tbn.al · Post by **tbn.al** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 12:20 pm

Miraphone 184 BBb. 2 and 4 B natural that is unplayably sharp. I must get bloke to make me a kicker for 2. The Eb below the staff is quite sharp as well but 1st slide is an easy reach. I've heard lots of folks complain about how sharp these are built overall but it is wonderful for me. I blow everthing flat so this is the first horn I've owned in years that I haven't had to cut. I cut 3/4" out of the main tuning slide and 3/8" off my Schilke 60 to get my current Besson bass bone down to pitch. I had a Yamaha 621 for a few months and really disliked it. The scale was nice and the respose was great but it didn't just sound right to me.

J.c. Sherman · Post by **J.c. Sherman** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 2:14 pm

Alex 164 6/4 (6/4?). Makes regular 163 Alexs seam perfectly in tune. Took a year before I'd play it in public - but WHAT a sound. Also, bell aged to much and simply shattered. Has a new bell and it's as good as ever!

Cerveny Pig - New to me. Very finicky about mouthpieces for decent pitch.

Boosey Eb - Wonderful. I only regret it's being "played" out, and has already had 1 overhaul.

Yamaha 621 F. Perfect for nothing, passable for everything.

Had a King Monster recording BBb rotory ax. LOVED this horn. Only sold it because there was nowhere socially aceptable to play it classically, wish I could've foun an upright bell... Fastest valves in the west, with the string linackage!

Had Kalison CC Daryl Smith. I only regret I dont have it - stupidest sale ever. Lyrical and lovely. The siren song of an Alex 163 got me to sell it, Kalison wasn't quite big enough, I thought. But sold 163 because anywhere I'd use it, I'd use the 164. But I want my Kalison back.

Had a 52J - My wifes favorite. Would take this back too, but not over the Kalison...

Sold my later King Eb sousa. Another dumb sale - fantastic horn. Paid for my wedding, though.

J.c.S.

bttmbow · Post by **bttmbow** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 2:53 pm

No instrument I have ever owned counts measures rest for me.

Once the technology catches up, though... I'll buy one of those, even if I hate the horn for other reasons!

CJH

FreeBandMusic · Post by **FreeBandMusic** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 11:08 am

Mirafone Bb 186 (`1952)
Raw brass finish. 2nd valve slide stuck since I bought it. Bottom bow is equipped with painfully sharp blade-type bumper.

Martin Eb
Never, ever get to play it.

Sterling Euph
Plays great; sound fits my euph concept perfectly. Good valves, good intonation after I had two slides shortened. Oh, things I DON'T like.... Silver plate was about one molecule thick. If I don't play it at least once a week, the valves lock solid. I think it's punishing me.

Former horns

Cerveny Bb 6814
This horn had a great sound, but it only had ONE. High, low, loud, soft, deep mouthpiece, shallow mouthpiece, all the same sound. I never found a way to color the sound or play with any expression.

Boosey Imperial 3 valve compensator
Big massive sound, decent intonation, perfect for community band... as long as you didn't need Db, C, and B below the staff, as they were unplayably stuffy. Also, it weghed more than my car!

John Thompson
Visit FreeBandMusic.biz

Wyvern · Post by **Wyvern** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 11:18 am

FreeBandMusic wrote: Bottom bow is equipped with painfully sharp blade-type bumper.

Of course that is to protect the bottom bow of the tuba (like those awful balls on the bottom of old B&H tubas), but at your discomfort

FreeBandMusic wrote: Martin Eb
Never, ever get to play it.

The obvious question is - why do you never get to play it

Liberty Mo · Post by **Liberty Mo** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 12:21 pm

The "King Spin" on a new 2341.

kingrob76 · Post by **kingrob76** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 12:58 pm

What do I like least?

Easy.

The depreciation in value they all seem to suffer, be it new or used, between the time I buy them and the time I sell them.

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 1:50 pm

kingrob76 wrote:What do I like least?

Easy.

The depreciation in value they all seem to suffer, be it new or used, between the time I buy them and the time I sell them.

Sheesh. You only have that problem because you try to sell them. Silly boy.

Rick "more apt to buy than sell" Denney

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 1:57 pm

Here's my beefs:

1. My Holton 345 does not come with a native bearer. And it's a heavy sucker. Ditto the York Master, which is even heavier.

2. The case for my Yamaha 621 doesn't have a music pocket.

3. My B&S F tuba punishes me (to a greater extent than my other tubas) if I don't play it every day.

4. The water key on the Holton doesn't quite reach out far enough so that I can nonchalantly empty it into the $&%*#&^#! trumpet player's case, which is always underfoot and in the way.

Rick "that's all for now" Denney

jeopardymaster · Post by **jeopardymaster** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:32 pm

tbn.al wrote:Miraphone 184 BBb. 2 and 4 B natural that is unplayably sharp. I must get bloke to make me a kicker for 2.

Check Tubatinker's site. He fashioned a kicker for my 186 BBb that is the bee's knees. The exact same issue was my biggest complaint with any of my current horns - now corrected. Thanks Dan! I am currently rehearsing Prok 5 with a local orchestra. I had been prepping for a while with my Neptune, but then I picked up the Mirafone and it was way easier!

Other complaints - my Neptune is an absolute bear to handle and my gnageyphone is awfully heavy, making playing it a bit problematic as well. Adding a playing stand has made a huge improvement - using it to play the 186 as well.

kingrob76 · Post by **kingrob76** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 3:20 pm

Rick Denney wrote:
kingrob76 wrote:What do I like least?

Easy.

The depreciation in value they all seem to suffer, be it new or used, between the time I buy them and the time I sell them.
Sheesh. You only have that problem because you try to sell them. Silly boy.

Rick "more apt to buy than sell" Denney

Just *once* I want turn a profit on a horn. I don't buy them for profit but it still wouldn't hurt. Tubas, except for MAYBE the two in Chicago, are not good investments.

Rob "not as liquid as Rick" Ross

IkeH · Post by **IkeH** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 6:11 pm

I'm a pretty good shopper and seller - at least will get even money back, usually a little profit. Never bought one brand new.

(These are all CC's)First horn was the little 2j, played great & in tune, just too small.

Had older 184(60's), out of tune and just funky, not well kept. Newer 184 (79) had shorter bell, played great, had been restored.

'63 186 - had it restored to playing condition by Bloke, great tone, pretty good intonation, valves not very fluid.

188, great horn, just too big for me.

185 was very good, recorded great, didn't like the sound live, very tall bell.

CB-50 - great intonation, tone was too fluffy, I like the Germans better, too resistant.

Liked the Rudy 3/4, great sound, intonation and projection, took a little too much air I thought for it's size.

Have a Piggy from the 60's now(Lee Stofer did work), super light, verrry easy blow(small receiver), nice dark tone, 3rd line D is flat, but most things can be easily lipped or otherwise compensated, great horn. All the water emptys out the water key, no spinning. Always liked the PT-4s but never had one.

Ike

bort · Post by **bort** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 7:24 pm

SplatterTone wrote:
BriceT wrote:Miraphone 1291: can't really complain about playing, but the brass is very thin and it is easily dentable
I'll second that. Close examination of my bell shows multiple indentations where my knuckles press against the bell when I pick up the horn. I try to avoid it, but the brain is not always focused. Even the slides are easily dented. My main tuning slide shows a very slight depression where the water key snagged on my pants leg as I was lifting the horn, and the slide dropped about two feet onto carpet. This is definitely not a school horn.

Where do your knuckles press up against the bell? I can't picture that...

I've never had any trouble with my 1291 denting easily... However, I did buy mine gently used (it was barely 1 year old or so) -- I guess that means the previous owner got the joy of inflicting the first few small dings.

My least favorite thing about the 1291 (and piston horns in general) is the amount of slide pulling and draining that happens on a regular basis. I don't remember doing nearly as much "emptying" work with my old rotary VMI.

Cameron Gates · Post by **Cameron Gates** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 7:25 pm

After reading this thread for what seems like 6 months I'll add to the bellyaching.

Miraphone 184 CC. Super instrument, not big enough to do anything except keep one (artificially) thinking they can blow the walls down. Simply a 5-8 carry-a-game scatback.

Miraphone 188 CC. I have nothing bad to say about this instrument except the owner is an idiot for selling it for:

Kalison Pro 2000. No high Ab. Period. Rides the pine but will make Sportcenter's highlight reel once a season doing something. An interception run into the other team's goal?

Big Rudy CC. Great instrument but I think it increased MY time in the 40-yard dash every time I pulled it out. This horn is for linemen only.

PT 606. Linebacker. Fast and lays out smaller backs. Could be a great tightend. Throws a block and can stretch the field. Really nice all-around instrument. Bad part is $$,$$$.

Nirschl big CC. Pinholes all over the knuckles and valves that are the worst on the planet. Plating also is a problem on some. Other than that it is good. Overpaid quarterback on a 8-8 team.

BriceT · Post by **BriceT** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 8:46 pm

Miraphone 1291 CC: the brass is very thin and is easier to dent than most horns, also the valves stick on occasion

MartyNeilan · Post by **MartyNeilan** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 9:16 pm

cktuba wrote:
Cameron Gates wrote: Kalison Pro 2000. No high Ab. Period. Rides the pine but will make Sportcenter's highlight reel once a season doing something. An interception run into the other team's goal?

Exactly, I have played a lot of Kalisons and none of them had a decent high Ab. The 2000 has a fantastic sound (addictive really) it responds well for a big horn and has pretty decent intonation... but that Ab...

Ab on the 2001's is spot on. Now the C above it, that's a different story. It's there, just a quarter tone flat unless you use an alternate.

Dan Schultz · Post by **Dan Schultz** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 9:57 pm

OldBandsman wrote:Miraphone 182.... Tuning slides are driving me nuts. Main band tries to tune to A=442. Requires main tuning slide to be all the way in. ...... Then there is always a problem with chairs. I'm so short that when I put the bottom bow on the chair I can't quite get my mouth up to the mouthpiece. Those cheap folding chairs, and some good ones, put my bum lower than the front of the chair. I carry around some cushions and my own chair most of the time. Gotta figure out how to grow a couple of inches....

Hi, John!

Bring that horn to NCOAMC this year and I'll bring along a hacksaw. We'll git 'er in tune! BTW.... I finally gave up on moving the leadpipe on every horn I play and bought a tuba rest. I don't care where the mouthpipe is now! I'll probably be bringing my St. Pete this year instead of the 5V 186... unless something else 'interesting' comes along before then.

See you at Ashland.

Jesse Brook · Post by **Jesse Brook** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 3:27 pm

I haven't the dough to have too much in the way of tubas, but I had a student Jupiter, back when they were a bit more questionable. The valves froze without provocation if unoiled for a day or two and the instrument itself was a lot like a large-bore trombone in sound.

My current instrument, a Yamaha YEB-321 has a much more mellow sound, and I like it, but the fetal position someone adapted the leadpipe for isn't so good. And the B-flat in the treble clef isn't steady, but that's probably just me (though the E-flat above that isn't bad).

To switch from sports to cars, the Jupiter was an older Kia that needed a ring job, and my Yamaha is an old Toyota where you can't adjust the seat.

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:17 pm

Greg wrote:I have a student who's tuba only plays in Eb major. I have not tried it out but that is what I am hearing.

Don't worry. It's only a minor problem.