Plastic valve guides

[justinbarleben]

I was playing the euph solo in Eric Whitacre's "October" in competition ye Isterday, and the first valve on my school's Yamaha 4-valve got stuck on the first Ab. I panicked and completely screwed up the rest of the solo. When I told my director that I had felt the valve rotate slightly before it got stuck, he said it was because of the plastic valve guides that Yamaha uses. Any experiences like this? Is there anything that I can do to prevent this from happening again?

I am a pretty good singer, maybe I'll just sing it next time

[Rick F]

Hi Justin,

I personally like the plastic valve guides in my Yamaha euph (YEP-641). They're very quiet and pretty much trouble free. I haven't had to change mine in about 3 years. The guide fits into the groove of the casing by only by about 1/16", so if you're a bit rough handling the valves... dropping them against the edge of the casing when oiling... they could get damaged and possibly lose their alignment.

You didn't say what model Yamaha euph you have? If it's a YEP-321 (4 valves in line), I thought that model came with metal guides? If you have a Yamaha compensator (641, 642, 842) then the plastic valve guides are pretty easy to replace since they mount atop of the valve. You need to order replacements from an authorized Yamaha dealer (if you need a P/N, post back and I'll get you that info). When replacing the valve guides, just be careful when disassembling and reassembling to make sure you get all the washers, felts and corks in the right order so port alignment is not messed up.

[tubaguy9]

I know the YBB-321's have these plastic valve guides...And I hate them. With a passion. On those, one of the problems is the fact that there are 2 holes that the valve guide could lodge itself into. And trust me-That has happened to me.

That's one of the many reasons I hate Yamaha...and will never personally buy a Yamaha tuba. Period

unless I get one of their York immitations for under $10,000

[Dan Schultz]

Those plastic guides are quite nice as long as they are handled with reasonable care. 'Slamming' the guide in the guide slot after oiling the valves can certainly cause undue wear to the plastic. One poster mentioned about the TWO holes in the top of the piston. The larger hole is a VENT HOLE. The smaller one is to locate the valve guide.

There's nothing wrong with the Yamaha plastic valve guides that a little tender loving care won't take care of. Pull the pistons out once in a while and take a look at the guide to make sure it isn't split, shaved, or frayed. If the corners aren't nice and square, replace it.

[J.c. Sherman]

Tuba Tinker is right on the money. However,

I generally think unkind thoughts about plastic valve guides. Owners of BM valves (Meinl Westons, B&S, and others) are constantly coming to me to replace them, and they have to be refit and refiled each time, and they're a pain to remove when they're worn. Grrrrrrr.....!!!!

The Yamaha ones are fine, but Tuba Tinker is right - pay attention to them and make sure they're well treated and in good condition. They, however, are also easy to replace, as are Jupiters'. And the new ones have a metal core, which gives a little warning before they go completely...

J.c.S. (who has the older metal guides on his Boosey Tuba and Yamaha Euph and is glad for it!)

[druby]

A common problem with the Yamaha guides occurs when someone turns the valve cap (playing with the horn during rests, or when spinning a valve while oiling) and loosens the stem. The twist-in stem is all that holds the valve guide in place. To properly reseat the valve guide, you should take the valve out, make sure the little tab is in the smaller hole (see above), push the plastic tab towards the stem as you tighten the stem (so the guide will not bottom out and bind in the slot), and tighten the stem completely.

These guides are (in fact) very robust and infinitely quieter and provide better alighment than the old metal tabs. However, I have had to do quick and dirty valve guide "reseat" operations on the YEP-201 at our school several times because the student who plays the horn sometimes absentmindedly "plays" with the valves by twisting the caps back and forth when he is counting rests or listening to the conductor during breaks.

Doug

[justinbarleben]

A common problem with the Yamaha guides occurs when someone turns the valve cap (playing with the horn during rests, or when spinning a valve while oiling) and loosens the stem. The twist-in stem is all that holds the valve guide in place. To properly reseat the valve guide, you should take the valve out, make sure the little tab is in the smaller hole (see above), push the plastic tab towards the stem as you tighten the stem (so the guide will not bottom out and bind in the slot), and tighten the stem completely.

These guides are (in fact) very robust and infinitely quieter and provide better alighment than the old metal tabs. However, I have had to do quick and dirty valve guide "reseat" operations on the YEP-201 at our school several times because the student who plays the horn sometimes absentmindedly "plays" with the valves by twisting the caps back and forth when he is counting rests or listening to the conductor during breaks.

Doug

Crap. This is exactly what I do. I never realized it actually affected anything...

[brianggilbert]

I bought BillEuph's Besson 982, and Matt @ Dillon's did the valve overhaul on it.

One of the things he did - replace the old Besson guides with those Yammie Guides. When taken care of, they're fast, reliable, and easy to deal with.

He also did a nice "hush" job on the valves too.

When I marched with the Crossmen in the early 90's, we had the original Yamaha converted tubas in G. The valves were difficult in that they were basic student-quality 201s, and the valves were not designed to be operated horizontally (imaging the horn on your shoulder). I'm sure they have improved the design on the newer horns, but these horns were literally the first 4 modified by Mike Dennis of Yamaha.

We went through white plastic guides by the handful. And a few gallons of valve oil to boot.