Due to the extreme gas prices...

[J.c. Sherman]

That's the ticket - a proper hybrid.

The modern current ones are so inefficient. I remember a Car and Driver article in the early 90s about a Dodge Intrepid that got 80mpg. How? It was an electric car, with e 3-cylinder deisel generator, plus regenerative braking. The solution - get the $%@# engine out of the drivetrain; let it idle in the corner supplying electricity. ("But I want better acceleration" - tough!)

I have no idea why we're so, well, stupid. Trains have been hybrids for decades. And internal combustion - no matter how many gizmos they attach to it - is 120 year-old technology. Electric is just as old. Why hasn't anyone come up with something better?!

An Electric would suit me well, as long as three tubas, bass trombone and euph could fit simultaneously. That's my biggest load. 95% of my days could be done just fine on a budget of 110 miles...

J.c.S.

[MikeMason]

This all sounds good to me.We just need to work on battery technology and efficient ways to generate the electricity,which is nuclear IMO.As far as acceleration,that's an area where electric cars excel.Can you imagine a world where we don't need foreign oil?The middle east is back to being only a desert,we would save a fortune on our military,much of which is deployed in various ways to ensure the flow of oil.Chavez is out of business.Think of all the possibilities for industry with cheap electricity,made with ingredients right here in our own western states.Maybe 10-15$ per gallon gas is the only way we will feel enough pain to accept changes.The problem is we may not live through it.Back to reality....

[MikeMason]

I was posting at the same time as tubajmc,so in response.I don't think a solution has to solve things forever,if it worked for 100 years,that sounds pretty good to me.The fact is ,there is alot of oil left.There is alot of nuclear material.And multiple sources of energy will definitely have to be used.It's a complex situation.In the mean time,sending billions to Sheiks,Kings,and dictators while we sit on large reserves just doesn't work for me.

[tubafatness]

As someone said before, less demand=less cost. I'm tired of hearing about the supposed political conspiracies that are out there, taking all of our regular folks' gas money. Quit buying so much!

Also, I think the increasing reliance on ethanol is a very bad choice. As most people know, ethanol is made with corn, or in some cases, soybeans. Using up these markets creates a shortage in food, which leads to higher food costs. Conversely, more demand=higher cost. If anything, I think the push for newer automotive power sources should be put into both electric power supplies and the fancy new hydrogen-run system, ( I think GM is at the head of that development, could be wrong though.)

It seems like people nowadays are so quick on the draw to blame someone else for a problem they help cause. The problem is that, in the capitalist economy that this country lives in, a good chunk of the influence is held by the people who buy stuff. Don't like the high gas prices? Then figure out a way to not buy so damn much.

[peter birch]

perhaps this is the way to go
http://www.innertuba.org.uk/

[MikeMason]

Alot can change in a hundred years.Just look at the last hundred.Of course I'm not for ignoring the long term problem.But if we ignore the short and near term situation,some really bad things can happen.If you thing things are bad now,try Islamic law.

[J.c. Sherman]

Alot can change in a hundred years.Just look at the last hundred.Of course I'm not for ignoring the long term problem.But if we ignore the short and near term situation,some really bad things can happen.If you thing things are bad now,try Islamic law.

Ah yes, the politics of fear.

I think you're getting a little to far ahead of yourself. Plus, you may be optimistic. Democracies are usually followed by dictatorships, but the transition's the real problem!

Myself, I'm working on my motorcycle this weekend. It's an antique, but it still gets 40 mpg...

J.c.S.

[MikeMason]

Fear,like guilt,love,boredom,awe,etc.,serves a purpose.It can help keep us from making really big mistakes.Not to say we should make decisions on only emotions,but they do play a role.

[Rick Denney]

This is an unfortunate byproduct of our uber capitalist society, but what can you do?

You do what people do in an "uber capitalist society".

1. You design and bring to market products that allow people who want to pay less for fuel to use less of it. If fuel is expensive, the alternatives to it are marketable.

2. You buy stock in oil companies. The profits of the oil companies are enriching millions of people, and certainly not just rich people. Just about anyone with a 401K is getting some benefit from oil profits.

In order to do 1, you need capital. To get capital, you sell stock--a share of ownership in your company. If you hit it big, you share the profit with your co-owners. Everyone becomes richer and buys more tubas. That's how it works. That's why we are still the most creative and productive society on the planet, even though we are just a shadow of a real "uber capitalist society".

Or, you can tax the oil companies, tax fuel, and tax profits, so that those who risk their capital no longer see the reward for taking the risk, and then there really won't be any alternative to oil.

Rick "recognizing the complexity of details, but emphasizing the simplicity of principles" Denney

[MikeMason]

Yeah,cause all I really want is to buy more tubas!

[greatk82]

It will haul my stupid @$$ wife...

Wow. I guess someone's hoping that Mrs. Bloke doesn't spend too much time reading tubenet!





Sorry, Joe! Had to do it.

[MikeMason]

A simple comma can mean the difference between life and death...

[tubafatness]

It contributed to "global warming" so as to help push those RECORD COLD FRONTS in Iowa back up into Canada (folks who actually deserve that sort of misery )

Last semester, every time I walked to my 8:00 class in the south of campus during snow, ice and consistent 0 degree weather, I thought, "Global warming? Really?" That was ridiculous. Especially when that was the weather in March...

[jmerring]

I think the price of gas is false.Our liberal politicians have blocked every attempt to harvest the vast supply of oil,coal,and gas we have right in America and have blocked every attempt to build oil refineries or nuclear power plants,for which we have a world class supply of fuel.Let's make sure we place blame where it's due.Supply and demand would quickly adjust for the current situation without governmental meddling,IMO.

I absolutely agree with you, Mike. I only have to commute about 75 miles (round trip) once a week to my rehearsals/performances and about 90 miles every two weeks to visit my incapacitated sister, but the cost of fuel is strongly changing my other driving habits. If the US were to fully explore and refine it's own natural resources, along with getting out of the way of the manufacture of 50+ mpg cars; we would be in far better shape.

[J.c. Sherman]

Perhaps it's best not to chime in, but...

To say everything is fine, burning whatever, embracing our creativity level now, loveing everything about things as they are is, well, unambitious (sp?) at best. Shortsighted and selfdestructive at worst. As musicians (this is a music forum, right?), this is our goal - to acheive, to grow, to learn, to improve, and to look ahead to challenges, to challenge ourselves, and to adapt to problems and changes in out environment, our bodies, and our minds. The inability to adapt, well, that's not the best way to become all one may as a tubist, a person, or a nation.

J.c.S.

[Nick Pierce]

Perhaps it's best not to chime in, but...

To say everything is fine, burning whatever, embracing our creativity level now, loveing everything about things as they are is, well, unambitious (sp?) at best. Shortsighted and selfdestructive at worst. As musicians (this is a music forum, right?), this is our goal - to acheive, to grow, to learn, to improve, and to look ahead to challenges, to challenge ourselves, and to adapt to problems and changes in out environment, our bodies, and our minds. The inability to adapt, well, that's not the best way to become all one may as a tubist, a person, or a nation.

J.c.S.

Here here!!!

[Tubaryan12]

Adapt. It's what we all must do. Who pays for my extra gas? McDonalds, Burger King, the little chinese restaurant. I carry my lunch to work most days now, so I have the extra cash to keep buying gas. I've made adjustments to my spending that will allow me to keep doing what I really want to and not worry about gas prices. If gas gets higher, the following things will be on the chopping block: cell phone, cable, golf....and if it gets really bad, my Friday nights off (part time job for me again). That way, I can continue to do the things I really want to do: Community bands and orchestras, internet usage, tuba related purchases. If things were really bad, I wouldn't be on this computer, telling you all how I'm going to pay for the more expensive gas I pump into my 35mpg car , I would spend that time trying to earn more loot so that I can continue to sit here in my free time, laughing with you guys and reading about tubas. life is good. If it wasn't, for me, you wouldn't be reading this.

- Officials still lie to us and manipulate markets to our disadvantages.
- "Journalists" still carry water for - and propagate the lies of - officials.
- Most people still believe the crap they are fed by officials and journalists.

Yep, yup, and yeah.

[kingrob76]

Politics aside, I have to believe this technology is the way to go. A rundown:

- 270 miles range
- 100 mph top speed
- zero emissions

Yes, there is the pressurized tank of hydrogen (Hindenburg, anyone?) but I have to believe engineers have addressed the vast majority of safety issues in order to make it road-worthy. Now, I'm not "green" in any way, shape or form - I just bought a Toyota Avalon that gets about 21 mpg - but I'll be first in line for a car with this technology once a) they're available on the East Coast and b) there are enough Hydrogen refueling stations to make every day use even remotely realistic.

cNet has a nice video on the vehicle and the home power station concept that Honda is developing, which is even more promising.

[ThomasDodd]

Solar? This is the most efficient of all alternative energy options, albeit expensive. Obviously, the sun is a limitless resource (limitless in terms of:when it runs out of energy, then we'll have more things to worry about than how are we going to keep our television running). However, once again, to meet the world's current energy needs we would have to cover a space roughly the size of southern California with Solar panels from end to end. And while we have spaces on our planet for such a task (The Sahara for instance), the task of producing, installing and maintaining that many solar panels is a bit out of our reach at the moment.

Don't forget though, we currently do not have the supply of silicon (pure, in ingot/wafer form) to make the solar panels. Solar companies are working to make the wafers thinner so they use less silicon and can increase output given the limited supply of silicon.

Of course, it would move a lot faster if they had the kind of money poured into their research that NASA did to get to put a man on the moon in the 60s.

How much did the government invest i oil drilling technology? Refinery technology? Distribution networks?

Oh yeah, that was the free market, not the government. Even the Alaskan Pipeline was a private venture, that had to fight government hurdles and road blocks to get built.

[ThomasDodd]

pressurized tank of hydrogen (Hindenburg, anyone?) but I have to believe engineers have addressed the vast majority of safety issues in order to make it road-worthy.

The Hindenburg was not solely due to hydrogen. Many factors lead to the fire after a year of service. It was designed to use helium, which became unavailable in sufficient quantities in 1930s Nazi Germany. And similar Helium filled craft burned as quickly in the same time period.

Also not, only 36 died, fewer than any recent air-line crash. Most of the deaths were from jumping out instead of riding it to the ground (23 of36 passenger survived, 39 of 61 crewmen survived)
Hydrogen is not any more dangerous that other, more common fuels, and less dangerous than many. It's more fear mongering.

FWIW, I think hydrogen is the best near term solution for vehicles. Combustion first, in slightly modified engines. Later, full cells to generate electricity will take over. The hydrogen source being electrolysis and the electricity coming from multiple sources depending on available resources. Nuclear, water, coal, wind and solar all have their place.