Lyon and Healy?

[windshieldbug]

The best place I know to start to get information about Lyon & Healey brass instruments is the Lyon & Healey section at Horn-u-copia.

[Donn]

It would be nice for feedback to see if I should put money on it, or let it be as is if it's a collectible.

It probably doesn't matter whether anyone's seen this exact make of tuba before - there can be a lot of variation between one tuba and the next of the same make anyway, not to mention what can further happen over a few decades. If this guy has any surviving siblings, some of them are probably really bad, maybe others are good, but that's not your problem.

As a very general statement, Eb tubas with only 3 valves aren't much sought after, because they make you depend on "false tones" for so many fairly common notes. The flatness you mention could be a leak or something that you could get fixed, and it might be worth getting an estimate if the tuba otherwise appeals to you, but I don't think you could expect to turn around and sell it for more than say $300 under any circumstances short of a miracle - so don't look at it as that kind of investment. If you like it, then it may be worth a few hundred to make it fun to play. My first Eb was a little Italian with 3 top valves, pretty similar to this one in fact, and while it's worth very little to anyone now, it was by far the most fun I had ever had playing tuba up to that time. Fun is worth a lot to me, don't know about anyone else.

[windshieldbug]

One thing that you might try is borrowing a bass trombone mouthpiece (which is about the same size and shank as a contemporaneous Eb mouthpiece) and see if the intonation improves any. It was probably built to use a mouthpiece this size, so a modern one, while possibly feeling more comfortable, may not work as well with the bore profile.

I'd try a smaller mouthpiece and see how it sounds.

Some of these horns were built to pitches other than A=400 before the turn of the 19th century, so the exact fundamental pitch number will be helpful to getting good advice.

It certainly sounds as though this is a rather common 3 valve Eb, so (and correct me if I'm wrong here, TNFJ) it's not irreplaceable (I've got several Eb's like this in my basement). You could replace the receiver, the mouthpipe, get it to play to modern pitch, have the valves redone, add 4th and 5th valves, put a new bell on it, and have it lengthened to BBb. All it takes is money...

[imperialbari]

Not all old instruments are worth tinkering with. My Bb and G trombones from 1922 and 1919 are not likely to get smooth slides, but they are beautifully decorated and engraved. My Cerveny Kaiserbariton from the same era plays wonderfully as does my 1923 Boosey 3+1 comper in F and my 1870 Besson 3+1 non-comper in Eb. The Cerveny is played with a DW SM2M. The Boosey has gotten a new receiver and may be played with a PT-50, but a DW4L fits its proportions better.

The 1870 Besson came with a mouthpiece almost as small as a large bassbone mpc. As the mpc rim was not to my liking, and as the tuba is British High Pitch (A=459Hz) I play it through a DW5.

The bug told about a lot one can do to older instruments. Some, like my 1870 Besson, are pretty rare by now, so I will rather not modify it irreversibly. But as it has potential for being a nice player within the niche of very small bore Eb tubas, I have put a bloodhound, actually a bloke of ours, on the track of some pieces of tubing having the inner and outer, respectively, bores of 0.981" to take the pitch the final stretch down to modern A=440Hz.

Klaus Smedegaard Bjerre

[Rick Denney]

Does anybody have ANY idea? It would be nice for feedback to see if I should put money on it, or let it be as is if it's a collectible.

Very, very few tubas are "collectible". Nearly all tubas are either sold as wall decorations or as players, not as museum pieces. Generally, posting a potential museum piece in the For Sale section will attract offers from those few who are building museums of tubas, and if it doesn't, you have your answer.

Most collectible tubas are such because of their provenance--in other words--they are collectible because of who owned them.

The tubas I have seen that are collectible merely because of age come from the Civil War era or earlier. They have to be made by someone who was highly respected (example: Distin) or be of a style that is popular for historical re-enactments (example: Over-the-shoulder saxhorns). Neither of these apply to this typical small Eb three-valve tuba, near as I can tell. I have a Missenharter that's easily 110 or 120 years old. And even before I attacked it with a torch and a hacksaw, it wasn't worth much, and it has four valves. My nickname for it is "Solder Practice".

Rick "who has never seen a typical old small three-valve Eb sell for more than a few hundred bucks" Denney

[imperialbari]

And even collections of brass instruments are more interesting for documentation purposes, if the instruments can be played.

Does your instrument tell an extraordinary musical story, when you or others play it, or is it a run-of-the-mill tuba, as bloke called a York 3P Eb tuba, from which he scavenged the bell for one of his at least two amazing helicon projects. bloke made these York and Buescher helicons into pieces of art, at least of extreme beauty. He easily could have stopped the restoring after having created superb players with more ordinary looks, but he has the pride of his craftsmanship.

What do you expect from your instrument? Please compare those ambitions with the potential costs of carrying them out. I think the answer will be very obvious to you.

Klaus Smedegaard Bjerre