Making a bell heavier

[MaryAnn]

I guess it was my turn to be "mocked." I'll strongly consider buying a new alto, sawing the bell off with my Sawzall, and doing the rest of what Joe "suggested." I especially like the prospect of having solder runs all over the rest of it; would make it a mighty unusual looking instrument, one that I could perhaps sell for twice what I paid for it on the *bay, if I referred to the fact that mid-south music had recommended this particular means of improving the instrument.

Only tooted it for 30 seconds in the store, on the stock mouthpiece, which I didn't look at very closely. They also had a used Yamaha but I didn't ask the price, should have.

Going back to old Tubenet, wasn't it Rick who installed solid metal rods down the inside of his bell, at one point? And liked the result? I remember the picture but not the specifics.

Were I to play alto it would be using my horn mpc with an adapter; might sound just fine that way. For some reason the conductor of the brass band doesn't want a "real" horn on the "horn" parts. So...I decided not to bother, altogether.

MA

[imperialbari]

It was Jay Bertolet having vertical sound rods installed in a huge Cerveny’s bell inspired by a teacher or colleague.

With the general love or the opposite for the alto horn we may twist the more funny sides of an ongoing battle:

An alto horn with lipstick all over the bell will still be a pig.

But the bell will be heavier.

Some brass bands have made fine music with French horns replacing the usual alto horns. A pioneer in that area was Geoffrey Brand and his City of London band some 35 years ago, but then he could pick the best students from all of London’s conservatories. The French horns project better than the altos, but they also create some problems. Traditionally the altos form a sound bridge between the flugelhorn and the baritones, and that is a function not easily done on French horns.

Klaus Smedegaard Bjerre

[imperialbari]

Only tooted it for 30 seconds in the store, on the stock mouthpiece, which I didn't look at very closely. They also had a used Yamaha but I didn't ask the price, should have.

Yamaha has had various alto horn models over the years. My first hand experience is with the original YEH-201 of many years ago. Musically that was a very decent competitor for the Class B British instruments of the same price range, as the Yamaha was way better in tune with itself.

Some twenty years ago there was a model with a trigger on the third slide. A good idea, but that model had other tuning problems according to my sources.

If you find an old YEH-201 make sure the pistons are not pitted, as they had a problem in that area. Also make sure the 3rd slide is not damaged. If you can make that slide run well, then you have every chance that you can play well in tune with a little trombonizing.

Klaus

[tubamirum]

The cryogenic treatment has not been scientifically proven. Everything I have read is subjective, if a valid test is available, I would like to read it.

[imperialbari]

The cryogenic treatment has not been scientifically proven. Everything I have read is subjective, if a valid test is available, I would like to read it.

If you want to test your instrument during the treatment I would recommend a Kelly mouthpiece.

Klaus

[iiipopes]

The cryogenic treatment has not been scientifically proven. Everything I have read is subjective, if a valid test is available, I would like to read it.

This is about the closest it gets to an objective cryo test:

http://www.whc.net/rjones/jlynch/cryo/" target="_blank

[MaryAnn]

I asked the guy at Dillon's to look at the pistons, and he said the monel was starting to come off. So....yeah it's cheap but there is a reason. Dillon's continues to impress me with their honesty.

Thanks for the link.

MA

[imperialbari]

I asked the guy at Dillon's to look at the pistons, and he said the monel was starting to come off. So....yeah it's cheap but there is a reason. Dillon's continues to impress me with their honesty.

Thanks for the link.

MA

Never heard of monel coming off. Isn't that the very alloy the piston is made out of?

What happens to the first generation of bottom sprung Yamaha brasses is about a brilliant idea turning rotten. Each piston guide has an adjustment screw to expand two wings to make up for wear. Sadly that screw is out of a metal causing the piston material below the nickel plating to corrode. Eventually the bubbles in the nickel will burst and a bad pitting will become visible.

I don’t wonder about that shop trying to tell a little old lady nonsense. I rather wonder about exactly that little old lady buying that story. Fortunately she didn’t buy that alto horn.

Klaus

[imperialbari]

The concern of the OP has been approached in different ways.

Amrein of Lübeck in Northern Germany offers these rings for an after-market placement on trumpets:

http://www.musik-amrein.com/gb/product/ ... tm?prod=11

The English translation makes very little sense compared to the German text which already touches on voodoo. Still I am considering buying these rings for instruments with an unwanted ring.

I can’t find it on the web now, but I have seen Christian Lindberg advertise Conn trombones and some corduroy thing to strap weight to the bell stack.

From just about all sorts of German/Czech brasses we know the Kranz/garland most often made of nickel silver.

Klaus Smedegaard Bjerre

[Dan Schultz]

I asked the guy at Dillon's to look at the pistons, and he said the monel was starting to come off. So....yeah it's cheap but there is a reason. Dillon's continues to impress me with their honesty. Thanks for the link. MA

Monel doesn't 'come off'. It's an alloy... not a plating.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monel

[Rick Denney]

I asked the guy at Dillon's to look at the pistons, and he said the monel was starting to come off. So....yeah it's cheap but there is a reason. Dillon's continues to impress me with their honesty.

Since, as you've read, the valve is solid Monel, the appearance of brass-colored patches on the valve are from the inside of the casing that has rubbed off onto the valve. It comes off with proper cleaning (which may involve a bit of expert buffing). I've seen on Yamahas that have Monel valves.

Older valves were nickel-plated brass, and the nickel plating can sure come off.

Rick "suggesting a closer look" Denney

[imperialbari]

Since, as you've read, the valve is solid Monel, the appearance of brass-colored patches on the valve are from the inside of the casing that has rubbed off onto the valve. It comes off with proper cleaning (which may involve a bit of expert buffing). I've seen on Yamahas that have Monel valves.

Rick "suggesting a closer look" Denney

Where can MA read that the valves of a YAH-201 have solid monel pistons? Not in this thread beyond the quote from a retailer representative.

When did Yamaha ever use monel for their 2XX-series of alto horns?

The story was told as is right after MA’s most recent posting on this thread. No need for no closer look. The first generation of Yamaha’s upright brasses represented a huge advance in tuning from previous student models. Today they are very dubious buys due to the accelerated pitting compared to nickel plated valves by most other major makers.

Klaus Smedegaard Bjerre

[Rick Denney]

Where can MA read that the valves of a YAH-201 have solid monel pistons?

If the literature says "Monel", they are solid. Monel has never, to my knowledge, been used to plate brass valves.

Most of the valves I've seen recently are called "stainless steel", which is probably very similar to Monel. Doesn't Besson use Monel? They may call them "stainless steel" now, but it's probably the same stuff.

If there is plating that is worn off, then it's mostly likely not Monel. It's probably just nickel-plated brass, which is, of course, what Besson used to use. I don't know what Yamaha does in their budget lines. All their upper-end instruments have solid Monel valves.

Rick "at home on dialup or he'd look it up" Denney