Abe Torchinsky and the Bach 18 mouthpiece

[TubaBobH]

I have heard on this forum, and elsewhere, that Abe Torchinsky used a Bach 18 mouthpiece during most of his career. Does anyone know with which tuba(s) he used the 18?

[jeopardymaster]

No idea about the mouthpiece, but as I recall he spent a lot of his time playing a beauty of an old King rotary valve BBb. Surely some of his former students post here.

[Art Hovey]

I saw Abe T. with the Philadelphia Brass Quintet around 1959 at a NYSSMA summer reading clinic. He was using a rotary King CC tuba like Bill Bell's, and a stock King mouthpiece. (Not my favorite mouthpiece, by a long shot!) At the tuba workshop session someone asked him about the mouthpiece, and he replied that he was trying to learn to play well on ANY mouthpiece, like Mr. Bell. The King mpc was just the one that he happened to pick up that day.

By the way, Dave Gannett now has a reissue of the the quintet's jazz arrangements, which were performed at that clinic. It's a very rare recording, because Eugene Omandy had it yanked from the market. If it weren't for Mason Jones they all would have been fired.

[jspeek]

I spoke with a long-time student of Abe Torchinksy who explained to me that there weren't many mouthpieces around at the time. You had the stock mouthpieces (miraphone, bach, conn). His students played on Bach 18's while at Michigan and they played them on F and CC tubas.

[Jay Bertolet]

As a long time student of Mr. T. back in the day at Michigan, I remember fondly that he had a drawer in his desk filled with mouthpieces. I asked him about it once and he said that he went through phases where he thought one or another mouthpiece sounded really good at the time. He always recommended the Bach 18 as a starter mouthpiece and as one of the most versatile mouthpieces around. He certainly used the 18, as well as many other mouthpieces he owned, on virtually every tuba he played. I'm not totally clear on exactly what horns he had during his career because by the time I studied with him, he had already retired from the Philadelphia Orchestra. What he had in his tuba studio at UM was his legendary King CC and a King Eb that was a sort of smaller copy of the CC and designed to pair well with his CC.

Regards,

[SplatterTone]

he went through phases where he thought one or another mouthpiece sounded really good at the time.

I resemble that remark ... although the PT44 sounds and plays good for me through most phases.

[imperialbari]

The matter of varying phases may be based in physiological reality.

Human tissue including that of the embouchure area will vary over the lifetime of any player. But then everybody goes through very much shorter cycles also. Personally I am more affected than most due to my rather severe allergies towards food.

My weight will vary with up to 2 or 3 kilograms from day to day, which of course is a matter of water collecting mostly in my skin. My playing isn‘t affected as much on the instruments where I use fairly large mouthpieces (PT-50 on the contrabass tubas) as on instruments, where I use fairly narrow mouthpieces (DW 4 & 5 on the small bass tubas).

Klaus

[SplatterTone]

The matter of varying phases may be based in physiological reality.

Some days a mouthpiece will feel completely different than on other days. I have to wonder if it is my brain that is different or my face. Perhaps a difference in hydration, water retention, muscle tone from playing (or not playing) the previous day. But I don't want to be unscientific and blame physiology when it might be brainiology. So, I'll leave it a mystery and always keep an assortment of mouthpieces handy. QUITE an assortment.

[imperialbari]

The matter of varying phases may be based in physiological reality.

Some days a mouthpiece will feel completely different than on other days. I have to wonder if it is my brain that is different or my face. Perhaps a difference in hydration, water retention, muscle tone from playing (or not playing) the previous day. But I don't want to be unscientific and blame physiology when it might be brainiology. So, I'll leave it a mystery and always keep an assortment of mouthpieces handy. QUITE an assortment.

Our approaches are different (and your English wording is better, of course). I have been through mouthpiece experiments, and that is more than my brain can manage over extended periods. Even if I am not entirely happy with the small DW mouthpieces I for now have settled with

PT-50 for the BBb contrabasses

DW1 for the CC contrabass which takes a small stem

MF-3H for the large Eb basses (Besson 981, Conn 26K & 28K)

DW4L for the smallish Boosey F

DW5 for the really small Besson Eb from 1870

Klaus

[Matt G]

I actually picked up a Bach 12 a while ago, but that didn't help either.

Find a Bach 7 tuba mouthpiece. I found this to be a good match to my old 188. It is a semi-large mouthpiece, but nothing outrageous.

[Ace]

I actually picked up a Bach 12 a while ago, but that didn't help either.

Find a Bach 7 tuba mouthpiece. I found this to be a good match to my old 188. It is a semi-large mouthpiece, but nothing outrageous.

I had never played a Bach 7 until I bought a used Conn 52J CC which came with one. I love the mouthpiece, even better (for me) than a PT-50 I had used for many years.

[imperialbari]

I had never played a Bach 7 until I bought a used Conn 52J CC which came with one. I love the mouthpiece, even better (for me) than a PT-50 I had used for many years.

Am I right in assuming, that the 7 is a bit smaller than the PT-50, and that you get more clarity and focus by using the 7 for that .689 CC?

Klaus

[Ace]

I had never played a Bach 7 until I bought a used Conn 52J CC which came with one. I love the mouthpiece, even better (for me) than a PT-50 I had used for many years.

Am I right in assuming, that the 7 is a bit smaller than the PT-50, and that you get more clarity and focus by using the 7 for that .689 CC?

Klaus

The "clarity and focus" is about the same (for me) on both mouthpieces. I like them both. But, the Bach 7 seems more comfortable on my chops. YMMV

BTW, Klaus-----I really enjoy your contributions to the board. They are most informative. Keep up the good work.

Ace

[jeopardymaster]

Re Mr. Torchinsky's horn, of course it was a CC - brain fart here. Was his a custom job? Was the CC ever a stock item? Any more of them out there? Surely it wasn't cut from a BBb, right?

I've read some background on the old Conns and played one of them, but next to nothing about the Kings.

[SplatterTone]

Speaking of phases ... Over the weekend, I decided to get out the Yamaha Roger Bobo Symphonic (replica cuz I'm cheap). I have never been able to get this thing to work well. But, assuming everything is on the up and up, and Bobo didn't let his name get stuck on this MP just because Yamaha handed him a stack of cash, then I keep thinking there must be some potential locked in there somewhere. So I get it out periodically to see if I am ready to unlock the magic. Ye gods! It happened this weekend.

For inquiring minds: It's wide-ish with a medium depth bowl intended (so I conclude) to achieve a piercing sonic punch more than a phat, wall to wall fundamental. That has been my conclusion right from the beginning, but I have never been able to make it happen. Well, I made it happen. Hubba hubba. A regular sonic arc light.

If you got nothing better to do than to listen to a couple verses of hyfrdol, here is the Bobo Symphonic, a 191, and me trying out for sonic Demolition Man (blew the embouchure apart twice, oops) seeing if I can clobber three trumpets, two trombones, one horn, 50-something rank Aeolian-Skinner, and about 600 people. I'm so crude and tasteless. (file is about 5+ MB and the last low F was two full breaths.)
http://t-recs.net/mpegs/tubenet/hyfrdol.mp3

By the way, the 32-foot stops on the organ are new (like two weeks ago) electronic from Walker (American company, not the English, and not the German Walcker).