Finally a 3D picture of CC-291B Bruckner

[chhite]

Mark Carter at Mr. Tuba would be the best to ask that question. It was residing at his booth.

[Kevin Hendrick]

Mark Carter at Mr. Tuba would be the best to ask that question. It was residing at his booth.

Thanks for the tip! If I could get there, I'd ask him in person -- will check his website.

[Wyvern]

It seemed not ok that a fafner did not get a 5th valve.
I'm not much of a slide-puller, so I like that extra valve on a BBb. There is definitely no reason why a BBb should not have 5 valves, while a CC does.

Only strange that there is no 5-valve rotary version... although competition has it: Miraphone 191.

Wim, Although not listed as a version, 5 valve rotary Fafner are available to order. Apparently the 5th valve is a dependant valve meaning it is set in the 4th valve loop, so only works in combination with the 4th valve. They decided on that layout to avoid spoiling the Fafner's response in the higher register. Speak to Mark Carter at http://www.MrTuba.com" target="_blank who knows all about it. He has supplier a few 5 valve Fafner to brass bands.

[Ferguson]

At Musikmesse.

Played 291.

Want.

Silver.


No 190 here, will debut at SWRTEC, late May.

Best,

Ferguson

[oedipoes]

Wim, Although not listed as a version, 5 valve rotary Fafner are available to order. Apparently the 5th valve is a dependant valve meaning it is set in the 4th valve loop, so only works in combination with the 4th valve. They decided on that layout to avoid spoiling the Fafner's response in the higher register. Speak to Mark Carter at http://www.MrTuba.com" target="_blank" target="_blank who knows all about it. He has supplier a few 5 valve Fafner to brass bands.

Is that because the 5th valve is normally on top of the other 4 on rotary horns, and the lead pipe enters there?
mm, is that common practice with piston valve tubas too ?
(willson FA-5, Miraphone 1291, melton ...)

wim (becoming very interested in the price of a piston fafner, hope no 6450 price...)

[oedipoes]

google did it again

melton 195 5p.jpg

and I added the PT6-P for reference

pt6p-resized.jpg

[oedipoes]

PRESSEMELDUNG
Wenzel Meinl GmbH
Musikinstrumentenmanufaktur
Seniweg 4
D-82538 Geretsried
Tel.: +49 (0)8171 – 92187-0
Fax: +49 (0)8171 – 92187-19
E-Mail: info@melton.de" target="_blank
Web: http://www.melton.de" target="_blank
Frankfurter Musikmesse 2009
Halle 1.1 Stand F21
Ansprechpartner: Vincent Ribes
Die Melton Kontrabaß-B-Tuba 195 „Fafner“
nun auch mit Perinetventilen erhältlich
Mit der Melton B-Tuba 195 „Fafner“
mit Zylinderventilen hatte die
Geretsrieder Blechblasinstrumenten-
Manufaktur Wenzel Meinl GmbH
bereits einen neuen Standard im Bereich
der Orchesterinstrumente gesetzt.
Obwohl sich die „Fafner“ nicht nur in
Deutschland, sondern auch in
Sinfonieorchestern oder Army Bands in
den USA bewährt hat, gab es vor allem
aus Übersee geradezu vehemente
Anfragen nach einer Version mit
Perinetventilen.
Mit dem neuen Modell 195/5P
(5ventilig) bzw 195P (4ventilig) wird
nun diese Lücke in der Modellpalette
erfolgreich geschlossen und erstmals
bei Melton eine große B-Tuba in
Perinetventilausführung angeboten.
Melton / Meinl-Weston B-Tuba 195/5P
• Modell "Fafner"
• 5/4-Größe
• 4 Perinetventile, 1 Zylinderventil
• Bohrung: 19mm; 4. Ventil 20mm; 5. Ventil 20,5mm
• Schallstückdurchmesser: 48cm
• Höhe: 105cm
• Messing-Korpus
• lackiert
Option: Hochglanzversilberung
Vertrieb für Deutschland, Österreich und Benelux:
Arnold Stölzel GmbH, Wiesbaden
info@stoelzel-music.de" target="_blank // http://www.stoelzel-music.de" target="_blank
Vertrieb Schweiz:
A. Marcandella AG, Schaffhausen
marcandella@marcandella.ch" target="_blank // http://www.marcandella.ch" target="_blank

[oedipoes]

Ok, so I thought this 85% American Tubenet would be more enthousiastic about this particular instrument. I'd bet this is the first picture of it on this forum.

As the text says, it has been developed especially for those BBb players on the other side of the ocean (from our point of view, that means the American side ) that prefer a piston valve setup.
It will be available as 4 piston or 4 piston + 1 rotary.

I put the PT6-P below the Fafner, because it really is very similar.
Just hope that the mouthpipe is also goldbrass.

Wim

[Wyvern]

Ok, so I thought this 85% American Tubenet would be more enthousiastic about this particular instrument. I'd bet this is the first picture of it on this forum.

I would have thought it just the instrument for those you want a modern equivalent of the classic American BAT in BBb. You are right Wim, where is the excitement???

I wonder how it will play with the smaller bore than the rotary Fafner? I bet more manageable and not take as much air as a German Kaiser.

Just hope that the mouthpipe is also goldbrass.

All Melton/Meinl-Weston tubas are made with gold brass mouthpipe as standard

[oedipoes]

I wonder how it will play with the smaller bore than the rotary Fafner? I bet more manageable and not take as much air as a German Kaiser.

I'm not sure about that. The willson 3100FA-5 I tested once took a big amount of air too. But I hope to test this piston valved Fafner next to the rotary once, when I'm tuba-shopping. I'm very curious about the result! I hope they managed to keep some of the Fafner kaiser-sound in the pistons.

Just hope that the mouthpipe is also goldbrass.

All Melton/Meinl-Weston tubas are made with gold brass mouthpipe as standard[/quote]

nice !

Wim

[Kevin Hendrick]

... some of us can't yanks even pronounce Bohme "correctly" ...

... that's Bohme as in "Bohme Shave"?

[Matt G]

From pictures alone, the piston Fafner looks very different than the PT-6P.

In regards to the valve set, the PT has the standard (semi-awkward) tube routing that is common to PT and VMI contrabass piston tubas. The Fafner's routing is very similar to the routing on MW contrabass tubas, which seems to work a little better. On the MW set, you gain better accessibility to the 4th valve, while giving up a bit to 3rd, unless you install a pull ring. The PT/VMI routing put the 3rd slide as the easiest to access (having owned a WMI 5198) while slightly impeding first and putting 4th off to the side.

The top and bottom bow look to be a decent bit larger, leading to a larger diameter at the ferrule butting the bell to bottom bow. The Fafner is probably closer in dimension to a PT-7P or VMI 5198, but those horns are squatter and look a bit wider than the "lean" look of the Fafner.

In regards to the pistons being made for the "Overseas" (re: American) market, I am fairly positive that the home team likes having the option as well. Although the initial bore might be a bit smaller, pistons tend to blow more open than rotary valves. Having played a few horns that have offered both, the pistons always seem to have a bit less resistance than rotaries, specifically in the lower register.


One curiosity. Does anyone notice how the tuning crooks of the valve set look suspiciously familiar to the add-ons that MW offered to turn the 2165 into a "BBb" tuba many years ago?

[ZNC Dandy]

That is a stunning looking tuba. The Fafner and the Bruckner. Thanks for the pics!

[cdatuba]

At Musikmesse.

Played 291.

Want.

Silver.


No 190 here, will debut at SWRTEC, late May.

Best,

Ferguson

Please, can you specify your impressions of 291?
Compared with a 188, and other horns like pt6?
Thanks in advance. I´m ansiously waiting... and someone reply´s are welcome!!!!!

[Toad Away]

... some of us can't yanks even pronounce Bohme "correctly" ...

... that's Bohme as in "Bohme Shave"?

[J.c. Sherman]

I didn't see any mention of it here, but what's with the top bow of the Bruckner?!? it looks like the slide bow of a Taylor Trumpet!

J.c.S.