Any ideas on this tuba?

[humphrey]

Hi chaps

whilst perusing the British arm of a well known auction site I came across this:

!B(h1GUwBGk~$(KGrHgoH-CYEjlLl8jjFBKcwi5ONH!~~_3.jpg

I'm a traditional British EEb player so I have NO idea of what model BBb Miraphone this could be. I'm thinking of adding a contra to my arsenal but HATE the Besson BBb's I've played so this looks interesting.

More details here:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Miraphone-5-Rotar ... 286.c0.m14

Cheers

Russ

[Z-Tuba Dude]

My guess is that it is pitched in C.

[humphrey]

Here's the description from the website:

I am selling this magnificent professional model Miraphone BBb 5-rotary valve tuba on behalf of a friend. He has decided to sell because nowadays he only uses his smaller 3-valve Miraphone and he needs the houseroom! I cannot determine the model serial number and can only describe its dimensions and features.

The total height is a staggering 115cm. The bell diameter is 50cm (20 inches), and the bore at the valve tubing is 21.8mm on my vernier. The tuba weighs in at 11.3kg. The finish is epoxy lacquer over yellow brass and nickel silver. The garland and rotary valve caps are engraved. I would categorise this instrument as a 5/4 size, but you have to make up your own mind on this. The model doesn’t correspond to current models offered by Miraphone, and I would gues its vintage to be 1980’s. The thumb actuated fifth valve appears to drop the pitch by a two tones and substitutes for a 2+3 combination. There are no large dents, just a few dent remnants, dings and scratches to the lacquer. I have had to replace two missing rotor capping screws by non-matching screws of the same thread, but it should be possible to get genuine replacements if need be. At some stage the bottom bow has been removed for dent work, and the lacquer is a bit scorched at the joints, but not very noticeably. All slides are free and lubricated.

There are more pics if you follow the link in my first post. Interesting setup on the fifth valve.... Anyone familiar with this two tone valve arrangement?

Cheers

Russ

[Toad Away]

It's a Mira BBb model # 190 (Kaiser)

[Wyvern]

I also think it is a model 190 Kaiser BBb tuba. Foden Band (???) used two of these in the 1980's while Howard Snell was conducting which had 5 valves specially to cover the brass band music. Maybe it is one of those?

I would think this could be a good buy if you can get at reasonable price.

[oedipoes]

Hi chaps

whilst perusing the British arm of a well known auction site I came across this:

!B(h1GUwBGk~$(KGrHgoH-CYEjlLl8jjFBKcwi5ONH!~~_3.jpg

I'm a traditional British EEb player so I have NO idea of what model BBb Miraphone this could be. I'm thinking of adding a contra to my arsenal but HATE the Besson BBb's I've played so this looks interesting.

More details here:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Miraphone-5-Rotar ... 286.c0.m14

Cheers

Russ

It looks like the 5-valve BBb version of the Miraphone on this link:
http://www.daveamason.com/mirafone/190190.html

The guy who wrote the comment does not seem too impressed by the intonation of this BBb kaiser, he seems more impressed with the CC version.
The 5th valve does add more alternative fingerings to solve that problem...

The CC equivalent is for sale on this link, on a dutch 2nd hand stuff website:

http://muziek.marktplaats.nl/blaasinstr ... s=1#photo

Wim

[imperialbari]

It looks like the 5-valve BBb version of the Miraphone on this link:
http://www.daveamason.com/mirafone/190190.html

The guy who wrote the comment does not seem too impressed by the intonation of this BBb kaiser, he seems more impressed with the CC version.
The 5th valve does add more alternative fingerings to solve that problem...

The CC equivalent is for sale on this link, on a dutch 2nd hand stuff website:

http://muziek.marktplaats.nl/blaasinstr ... fs=1#photo

Wim

Fixed the Oedipal CC-link.

About the opening object of this thread:

It looks like the 190 Kaiser BBb in my catalogue scans but for the spiral springs and the 5th valve.

I would have preferred there being an option of changing the 5th to a long whole step, but then the actual wrap is well integrated in the architechture, and there appears to be plenty of pull distance.

This tuba would have had my interest, if the seller would ship it. I have bought 4 instruments from this seller and he appears to be honest.

Klaus

[EdFirth]

I think it is a five valved 190. They didn't make them for that long but Tommy Johnson had one in C that he used in the studios here.I've also heard rumblings of it being reissued with "improvements".My former teacher had one of the B flats and loved it.Ed

[Dan Schultz]

Preston, UK. Isn't that where Andy Cattanack lives? He used to post here. Speak up, Andy... and give us the lowdown on this horn.

[J.c. Sherman]

I'm pretty certain it's a 190-5U CC. I've never played one, but I've played the BBb. If it had been next to my Alex when I went shopping, I might have walked out with it instead - it's huge sounding and a hell of a lot easier to play!

They are now for sale at Ferguson Music:

http://www.hornguys.com/hornsinstocktuba.htm" target="_blank

New 5th wrap, but that goes for many of the older models still made.

J.c.S.

[oedipoes]

I'm pretty certain it's a 190-5U CC. I've never played one, but I've played the BBb. If it had been next to my Alex when I went shopping, I might have walked out with it instead - it's huge sounding and a hell of a lot easier to play!

They are now for sale at Ferguson Music:

http://www.hornguys.com/hornsinstocktuba.htm" target="_blank" target="_blank

New 5th wrap, but that goes for many of the older models still made.

J.c.S.

It's the BBb.
Did you check out the link to the Dave Mason site?
Look at the routing of the lead pipe especially.

Wim

[J.c. Sherman]

I'm on coke - you're right - BBb.

I shouldn't post so late - Brain is fried!

J.c.

[AndyCat]

Only just seen this thread! Had a look at the tuba today, lovely guy, never been a major player at all, pure hobbyist. Does look like a 190 from the pictures on the other site above. I took some myself.

Might have a bid out of interest myself, it's literall 1 mile from my house!

[Wyvern]

It looks in really great condition for its age. Much better than the only other one of these I have seen (at Mr.Tuba).

Did you get to play it Andy?

[AndyCat]

Yes, but didn't have my mouthpiece and only a Wick 2L, and I don't get on with them! It is in good condition, Derek Farnell has done some work on dent removal, but not too much. I'm having a punt on it, not expecting to win, but it would be a nice toy in the arsenal!

Needs that 5th valve after playing it, some quirky intonation going on!

[oedipoes]

Needs that 5th valve after playing it, some quirky intonation going on!

I suppose you're pretty experienced in Besson 994-type of instruments, so I guess you're used to some quirks...

Is it really so bad?

Wim

[Wyvern]

When I compared a Miraphone 190 to a Cerveny 601 at Mr.Tuba, I thought the latter was better in tone and intonation

[J.c. Sherman]

The BBb 4-valver I tried was a monster, and sounded wonderful. I didn't notice then any massive tuning difficulties. It was an overhaul, actually. It was disgusting and nearly unplayable at first. It had also been "repaired" so many times the darn thing was fit together like off-market legos. Afterwards it was, as I said, a terrific instrument with a massive tone; I'd love to have one for classic Kontrabasse Tuba parts, probably over the Fafner. I've never tried the behemoth Cerveny, so I can't compare. To tell the truth, when I saw that the 190 was coming back (and for sale at Ferguson) I was thrilled; they needed a true BAT in their arsenal. I hope I can try the CC some day.

J.c.S. (who's rambling a bit...)

[Peach]

Anyone here win this thing?
Went for a bit over £1k

[Paul Tkachenko]

Hi guys,

I bought the tuba and am very happy with it.

The fifth valve 'two whole tones' is common on older miraphones and works well although I must say I do prefer the long whole step. The intonation is fine if you use the fifth valve as intended.

Great punchy sound and a breeze to play for such a massive instrument.

I'm using it to replace my Cerveny - it sounds and plays much better.

Regards,

Paul