shipping scams?

[Mcordon1]

How do you tubenet citizens usually make an exchange by shipping? As in, does the seller ship the goods to the buyer, and the buyer "ships" the money(paypal, whatever)? It seems that way to me, an exchange based on trust.

I'm asking this question because I may be buying a horn soon and it needs to be shipped. My parents(the real buyers) are really concerned that they're gonna send money and I'm gonna receive nothing.

So, just so they can relax, how do you guys usually exchange goods and cash?

[tbn.al]

Trust is something that has to be earned. Either by your own experience or the experience of others that you trust. For instance, there are members of this forum that I would trust simply because I have observed their dealings for a long enough time that if they were not trust worthy some cloud of suspicion would have arisen by now. Barring the luxury of that lengthly observation period I would be very careful.

There are several methods to make a transaction more secure if you are not completely sure of someone's trustworthiness.

1. Use a credit card.
2. Use an intermediary, but you both have to trust them.
3. Don't ship, drive.

I have done probably 30 long distance horn deals over the years and have never had a problem. However, my turn may be next week.

[Alex C]

So much of a long distance purchase is based on 'good faith' in a person you haven't met, I think many of us understand your parent's anxiety.

I friend or mine feels that once he has talked on the phone with someone, he can tell if he will be comfortable or not. It has always worked for him.

I try to have a valid phone number and a home address, if I can verify them or (even better) cross reference the two, I feel reasonably sure that I can expect the deal to complete with no problem.

In addition, you should have a mutually signed contract.

[Mcordon1]

I would have driven in the first place, but I live in New York and the horn is is California. And, by the way, I do strongly trust the seller.

[Tuba Guy]

For my new horn, what my parents arranged (in the same boat as the OP at the moment) was to send half of the money first, and when the horn came in, send the other half. I don't quite know the details, but it worked out. Of course, it was a trustworthy tubenet member, so that did help make me feel more comfortable (and in turn, convince my parents)
If it's near me in CA, I could check that the horn is real/as advertised, if you would like.

[iiipopes]

And as the transaction progresses, ask the seller for details of how he's going to pack & ship, what carrier is to be used, the tracking number, whether you both agree on a specific insurance against damage for the value of the horn, using a mechanisim like PayPal or a credit card that has a dispute resolution service, and pictures of the horn.

One old chestnut used by some eBay buyers is to ask for a picture of the article in front of that day's newspaper from the city from where the article is supposed to originate, as one means of testing the authenticity of the seller. It's a bit off the wall, and I would use other means of establishing the legitimacy of the transaction first if I can.

Asking for references is always in order.

Yes, in the end, it's still a leap of faith and trust.

[Mike-ICR]

Some shippers (UPS and FedEx) can automatically send the recipient an email with a tracking number when the item is registered to be shipped. You could ask the seller to have that done and when you receive the emailed shipping notice then send the funds. If you work through PayPal, and I suggest you do, then the transaction can be done in an hour or two. The seller would have your money (and both of you would have the proof of that from PayPal) and the horn would be out of the sellers hands and on it's way to you (and you would have the proof of that from the shipping Co.). If something goes wrong on either end then you could file a PayPal dispute or the seller could stop shipment or have it returned to him. I've used this method before and it seems very effective and fair.

[MaryAnn]

Unfortunately with a tuba sometimes it isn't the honesty of the seller that is most important but their competence to pack it. I have not had very many tubas shipped to me, but only one of them arrived without damage. That was my MW 182, shipped by Matt at Dillion Music, and it was in a HUGE box and shipped by truck. The box did not look like it had done anything but sit in a locked room for a week. Other tubas.....oh, my. Sent in flimsy boxes with only three or four inches between the bell and the edge of the box; one was shipped upside down, resting on the bell. Another, from a dealer, was put in a box with some peanuts and a lot of cardboard. So....find out if the seller has a CLUE about packing a tuba for shipping, or you may be a very unhappy recipient despite the fact that the seller is honest. There are quite a few threads about packing a tuba for shipping, if you do a search.

MA

[pgym]

The seller can ship it COD, cost on demand.(Or is it check???)

Collect On Delivery

Then you tell them you have to first inspect the contents because it is a huge investment and tell them you'll be fast so they'll be ok. They are supposed to let you do this with this type of situation, if not refuse it the seller gets the horn and no $

A delivery person MAY, at his or her discretion, allow you to do this, but they are by no means REQUIRED to.

[ken k]

if you are buying a horn from someone on this site who has been a long time poster and member in good standing, I seriously doubt you would have any trouble. That being said, I would use Paypal and perhaps send out a contract to sign first so that the transaction details are in writing.

Ask for a return /trial period and also have the details in writing.

Understand that the buyer usually pays shipping costs both ways, unless another deal is agreed upon. Unfortunately with a tuba that can get expensive.

I have bought many instruments and motorcycle parts from people on internet forums such as this and have had no trouble; perhaps I just have been very lucky I do not know.

Getting someone to send out an instrument without paying first is unusual. You wouldn't expect to buy something from amazon or any such place wihtout paying first. I doubt Dillon's or Brasswind would.

ken k