Custom Yamaha Eb Front-Action

[Dan Schultz]

Hey, T.J.!

This is such a nice project... I thought I would share it with The World! It's not often I get a request to "turn this top-action tuba into a front-action tuba".

Your Yamaha Eb conversion is together and ready for a good play-test. I did play it last Monday at a rehearsal and it performed just fine for me.

Here's the link:

http://thevillagetinker.com/yamaha_yeb3 ... ersion.htm

[T. J. Ricer]

Hooray! I was itching to share the pics with the tuba community, glad to see it came together so well!

--T. J.

[Donn]

Looks like an interesting project. You don't explain why you chose to splice valves together, rather than start with a 4 valve cluster. Not available, or was it to make the 4th valve a different size (it's .728 in the original top action?) Are there any braces between the 4th valve tubing and the body?

[Bob Kolada]

Cool! But why the funny 5th valve setup? Does it HAVE to be a 2nd valve for the 4th valve? It seems that a 3rd or possibly 1st (upside down) would make for a more enjoyable 4th valve tubing wrap.

I suppose one could also order a 4th valve and casing from King and splice it onto a 3 valve set...

Recently, I bought an old going-too-cheap satin-gold 18" bell Conn Eb tuba (3V front-action) off of eBay simply to harvest the bell, but found (unlike the vast majority of old large Conn Eb tubas) that the overtone series of the bugle behaves itself pretty darn well...' predicament.

I didn't see that one... Sell it?

So bloke is now apparently up to 4 (?!) "funny tuba" projects...
-tiny top action Conn F
-almost as tiny front action King F
-cimbasso out of some sort of bugle
-this one

[UTSAtuba]

*drool*

[Dan Schultz]

Looks like an interesting project. You don't explain why you chose to splice valves together, rather than start with a 4 valve cluster. Not available, or was it to make the 4th valve a different size (it's .728 in the original top action?) Are there any braces between the 4th valve tubing and the body?

Like Bloke already explained... those 3V .688" King valvesets are in abundance on 'beater' student tubas and fiberglass King sousaphones. It's a lot less expensive to build a 4V than to look for and buy a 4V. Forget trying to buy complete valve sections from King. Of course there are braces on the 4th wrap. It just lies very close to the back bow.

[Dan Schultz]

Cool! But why the funny 5th valve setup? Does it HAVE to be a 2nd valve for the 4th valve?

Good questions. The best answers I can come up with are:

The 5th valve is wrapped that way to keep it above the leadpipe and create room for the players right arm to reach the valves. This particular conversion worked out pretty cleanly using tubing and slides from the original 'donor' rotary valve section. Nothing on these conversions is really 'made'. Some of the tubing is cut to make it in tune but the crooks and slide parts are simply reused from the donor stuff.

The 2nd valve is harvested from the 'donor' valve section so the open bugle will match up with the third valve. I suppose the 1st or 3rd could be used but it would place the fourth valve about an inch below the rest of the valve section.

Being a repairman... I can buy parts directly from Conn-Selmer (King, Conn, and others). However... they only sell components. NOT complete valve sections.

[J.c. Sherman]

Uh... what happened to the original valve section? And why not use that?

Just ... curious It's really beautiful work, Dan. You beat me to my dream project.

J.c.S.

[Dan Schultz]

Uh... what happend to the original valve section? And why not use that?

Just ... curious It's really beautiful work, Dan. You beat me to my dream project.

J.c.S.

The original YEB-321 is TOP-ACTION. I still have it. Wanna buy it? It would take an act of God to turn a top-action set into a front-action set. I've replaced knuckles before but totaling changing the tuning circuit orientation would be a bear.

This horn worked out so nice... I'm already thinking about doing the same thing with a Blessing B-450 tuba that's sitting here with no pistons in it.

[Bob Kolada]

I suppose the 1st or 3rd could be used but it would place the fourth valve about an inch below the rest of the valve section.

There are tubas and euphs like that, so it might be something to consider on a later project (more options!).

[Art Hovey]

I hope someone at Yamaha or Jupiter is reading this. They could learn a lot from the Tinker, and might even make some money by producing a few horns like this that are comfortable to play.

[Alex C]

The King valves are so close to the same size of the Yamaha that it's scary, what good luck with that. Very nice nice work, Mr. Tinker.

Would you have considered mounting the fifth valve after the valve set?

[Mike-ICR]

It would take an act of God to turn a top-action set into a front-action set. I've replaced knuckles before but totaling changing the tuning circuit orientation would be a bear.

I've only done it a few times and I've had very little success. Sometimes you can do it without re-knuckling any of the casings but that's very rare and the slides are even harder to fit. The couple that worked out ended up looking like the front action Kanstul tubas with all the valves in-line and all the slides exiting on the same side.


http://www.kanstul.net/detail.php?pass_ ... nd%20Brass" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank

[UTSAtuba]

Dan,

If money allows, would you be willing to do another project like this?

Joseph

[Dan Schultz]

The King valves are so close to the same size of the Yamaha that it's scary, what good luck with that. Very nice nice work, Mr. Tinker.

Would you have considered mounting the fifth valve after the valve set?

In this particular case, it was simply more convenient with the parts I had to put the rotor ahead of the valve section. The rotor is a few thousanths smaller than the cluster... another good reason to put it ahead.

Note to USTAtuba.... I don't put much time into the planning of these projects. They are based mainly on working with what parts I have available to me at the time. I just couldn't take the time to drop everything to search for specific components. That would drive the cost through the roof. I mentioned earlier that since 99% of the components come from 'donor' horns... not much is left to be made other than maybe parts of the trigger mounts and other hardware. All the crooks are reused from other horns. The leadpipes can usually be hand bent from stock parts from suppliers.

[UTSAtuba]

Note to USTAtuba.... I don't put much time into the planning of these projects. They are based mainly on working with what parts I have available to me at the time. I just couldn't take the time to drop everything to search for specific components. That would drive the cost through the roof. I mentioned earlier that since 99% of the components come from 'donor' horns... not much is left to be made other than maybe parts of the trigger mounts and other hardware. All the crooks are reused from other horns. The leadpipes can usually be hand bent from stock parts from suppliers.

Sounds good to me

[T. J. Ricer]

I just wanted to publicly thank Dan for even being willing to take on this project, let alone delivering a great tuba ahead-of-schedule and under-budget!

Dan was wonderful to work with; answering all my questions - trying to talk me out of it - and taking on the project when he saw that I was committed to it.

I highly recommend Dan and his work! He is a true wizard when it comes to using parts that already exist to create something new and better. . . If I'm not mistaken, the fifth valve linkage on this horn is a French Horn linkage turned upside-down.

I've had the horn about a week and a half now and find it to have a beautiful voice and solid pitch from the bottom to the top. Bravo, Dan!

[hbcrandy]

Great work, Dan!

I did a similar conversion, years ago, using a York, monster Eb tuba as my jumping-off point. For the 5th valve, I bought a rotary valve and 1st valve slide tubing from Gerhard Meinl. This is the valve that is used on the Bill Bell model Meinl Weston. It is .690". It works well with the .687" American valve sets.

Again, a fine job. Thank you for sharing it.

[tclements]

I want one, but you have to open up the 5th valve tubing!!

[T. J. Ricer]

Just in case anyone is interested, here's a video of my first orchestral performance with the new/old Yamaha/King Eb:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vCUmmqCZvs" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank

The horn really projects well and has a great sound! (I actually didn't realize just how well it was projecting, but the conductor and composer kept encouraging it!)

--T. J.