New Schiller

[Art Hovey]

This is not the first example of cloned tuba models. For example, the YBB321 is a copy of some old British design, and Weril has freely copied the Yamaha, although I still can't understand why. "Barringtons" are apparently clones of the Mirafone 1271, and I would love to have a chance to play both versions side-by-side. Cloned rotary tubas are even more plentiful, and lots of cloning goes on in the world of stringed instruments. Has anyone ever heard of a legal action brought against the copier of any musical instrument?

[sugawi]

After looking at the picture of this Schiller tuba it reminded me of a Jinbao I saw recently. Seems like Jinbao is the manufacturer for Schiller.
Here is JBBB 540
http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/23409 ... image.html
JBBB 550
http://jinbaomusic.en.alibaba.com/produ ... _TUBA.html
I also think that M&M are made by Jinbao since M&M has the same numbering on the horns. Can I conclude that Jinbao=Schiller=M&M?
Seems like Jinbao is the one who's copying bunch of horns.
http://spanish.alibaba.com/product-free ... 48009.html

[Bob Kolada]

****!

http://jinbaomusic.en.alibaba.com/produ ... _TUBA.html

Minimum order quantity: 2 pieces
Price: FOB xingang tiajin China USD 1258-1320

edited for stupid fingers also this is NOT the 1291 clone, but the 2341-ish clone

[sugawi]

Make sure when you'll order to ask them to engrave your name on the bell and we will start cult following of the limited edition

[Bob Kolada]

If you think that is something, check this out!
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=37962

[Wyvern]

****

[sugawi]

Seems the chinese are starting to copy some newer models.

mm-tu8000big.jpg

Schiller and M&M looks the same to me. Shall we call this thread "New Jinbao?"

[bisontuba]

HI-
The Chinese have made some rather questionable instruments in the past. Some of the early examples I saw looked like they didn't have 'rings' for bending tubes--some tubing didn't look round but like it was flattened out.
I am told by some engineer friends who travel to places like Brazil and China that the Chinese can still make really, really cheap/bad items like instruments if you want them (for the Walmarts, etc. who want it at the most low cost)--but they can also make anything--from bad to exceptional--it depends how much you want to spend. Even though cheap compared to European instruments, they can make very fine instruments--not just tubas, but look at their string instruments, etc. BTW, I was told by a Fox Bassoon rep that the Chinese are coming out with an $800 Fox clone that is better than their own instrument!
BTW, as I have said before, the 5 valve rotary CC 186 clone is the Schiller, which is the M&M, which is the JZ, which is the Dillon.
It's only a matter of time...you haven't seen anything yet. The wind turbines that are producing wind power are mainly made by GE here in this country--however, in Texas, the majority of those high tech machines are made in China (just an example of high tech making). Read the latest Nat'l Geographic and see the last article on Shanghai--a pretty amazing place, only getting bigger and more high tech.
Regards-
mark
jonestuba@juno.com" target="_blank

[Mcordon1]

Seems the chinese are starting to copy some newer models.

mm-tu8000big.jpg

Schiller and M&M looks the same to me. Shall we call this thread "New Jinbao?"

the 1291s bore is .835, and according M&M's site their horns bore is .827...

Thoughts?

[sloan]

Seems the chinese are starting to copy some newer models.

mm-tu8000big.jpg

Schiller and M&M looks the same to me. Shall we call this thread "New Jinbao?"

the 1291s bore is .835, and according M&M's site their horns bore is .827...

Thoughts?

There are copies...and copies.

[Dan Schultz]

I have one of the M & M 1291 BBb 5V clones on the way if anyone wants to come here to play-test it along side my REAL 1291. I'm not bringing one in for resale but rather just because my curiosity got the best of me. Who knows... I may end up keeping it for myself and selling the Miraphone. Or.... maybe I'll decide to get rid of BOTH of them and stick with my Marzan 'slant-rotor'.

Ahhhh..... so many tubas and so little time!

[Bob Kolada]

Cool! Is it literally on the way, or eventually?

[TUBAD83]

I have one of the M & M 1291 BBb 5V clones on the way if anyone wants to come here to play-test it along side my REAL 1291. I'm not bringing one in for resale but rather just because my curiosity got the best of me. Who knows... I may end up keeping it for myself and selling the Miraphone. Or.... maybe I'll decide to get rid of BOTH of them and stick with my Marzan 'slant-rotor'.

Ahhhh..... so many tubas and so little time!

Please let us know what you find out--definitely considering buying one later this year.

Something to think about: Imagine if there were no copies, no clones, no knock-offs, no "reproductions"--how many of us would be able to afford a Mirafone, MW, Hirsbrunner, or a Conn/King--even if it was used? It is a GOOD thing that there are decent affordable alternatives out there for tubists on a budget--agree?

[Bob Kolada]

I do think that, unless these are incredible playing solidly built horns, that $2500 is right about the ceiling for them. Though I've never seen a 1291 for less than $4000, I have seen several 191's in the $3xxx range.

What nickname have we come up with for this horn? I was just thinking Schiller 1291, but that's not very innovative....

[UTSAtuba]

Schillaphone 1291?

Eh, another lame attempt at a catchy nickname...

[sugawi]

What nickname have we come up with for this horn? I was just thinking Schiller 1291, but that's not very innovative....

We can call it 1291 Jinballer or Schillbao

[Dan Schultz]

I do think that, unless these are incredible playing solidly built horns, that $2500 is right about the ceiling for them. Though I've never seen a 1291 for less than $4000, I have seen several 191's in the $3xxx range.

What nickname have we come up with for this horn? I was just thinking Schiller 1291, but that's not very innovative....

I wouldn't refer to the horn as 'Schiller'. That's just a name for one of the companies that sells them. Schiller IS NOT the manufacturer and they are NOT in Frankfort, Germany. The horns that are sold by any one of a number of retailers around the US are identical... M & M and Baltimore Brass... just to name two companies who care to support TubeNet.

You should refer to this horn as a 1291 'clone'. Pick your seller according to what sort of support you might expect to receive from them. The 1291 'clone' that I plan to have here shortly has been provided to me for evaluation by M & M. If you want to come play it, just give me a shout. Probably have it in about a week.

[TubaTodd]

Probably have it in about a week.

This probably goes without saying, but we'll need a bunch of detailed, large size, different angled pictures for our horn pr0n collections.