Miraphone Waldkraiburg exclusiv

[P@rick]

I bought me a used Miraphone (Bb) and I'm pretty sure that this is a 186 (because it plays and sounds soooo nice ).



The Miraphone is engraved: Miraphone Waldkraiburg exclusiv 932h
Is "932h" a type/model? Is this something pre-186?

Sometimes these used Miraphone Waldkraiburg exclusiv's pop up and I was wondering whether this is just an engraving which Miraphone used in a sertain period for all there instruments or that this is an "exclusive" model which is build in parrallel to other "regular" models.

Does anyone know?

[P@rick]

...no reply on the second day...is it the missing hornporn or is the post that bad?

[Wilco]

bring it on

[P@rick]

bring it on

Hi Wilco, I edited my post with some exclusives

[bort]

To state the obvious...

...you might want to try contacting Miraphone directly and see what they can tell you about it. A while back, I emailed them about gig bags (I'd used one of their old style ones, liked it a lot, and wanted to buy one). Even for something so small, they were prompt, helpful, and (rightfully) took pride in their work.

However old that tuba is, it seems to have been gently used! And any silver rotary BBb/CC is a pretty rare bird for Miraphones!

[The Big Ben]

However old that tuba is, it seems to have been gently used! And any silver rotary BBb/CC is a pretty rare bird for Miraphones!

Perhaps the silver plate makes it 'exclusiv"?

[Rick Denney]

It looks like an older 186 in Bb. The Bb versions had a taller body than the C versions, making the bell seem less tall by comparison.

I seem to recall that the replacement bells have special markings for the serial number, but I don't remember the details of that. Perhaps this one has had the bell replaced at some point. The good condition of the bell certainly does not refute that possibility.

"Mirafone" was used in the U.S. primarily to avoid a trademark issue, as lore has it, from the days when the importer was based in Sun Valley. The company name in Germany has always been "Miraphone". This instrument appears to have been made for the European market--hence the German spelling of "exclusiv" and the spelling of "Miraphone".

The valve linkages predate the introduction of the ball linkages which occurred in the late 70's.

It doesn't look quite old enough to be an early 60's version, though most of those look because of condition as much as anything. This one is in great condition.

If (and this is pure speculation) the serial number reflects the general age, using a letter instead of the final digit to avoid conflict with a legitimate serial number, the 932-something number would date from the mid-70's, which fits the general appearance of this instrument.

Maybe with this bit of memory jog, someone will be able to remember the details of how numbering on replacement bells might have been handled, or numbering for the European market.

Rick "knowing only a few clues" Denney

[Dan Schultz]

To me... there are some things that really stand out on that horn....

1) I think Rick Denney's observation that the bell might not be original is appropriate as it appears that the engraving is not centered above the thumb-ring and lyre-holder backing plates. That might indicate that the bell was slightly rotated before those pieces of hardware were re-applied.
2) In accordance with the observation in line 1... the leadpipe looks too perfect to not be new.
3) This horn is/was someone's 'pride & joy'. ... a bit of a custom. Is that a pull-knob on the 1st slide?... or is it some form of pressure release?

[P@rick]

Whow...post some pics and you get attention

Thanks for your interest.
To answer some question:
- The bell is exactly 45cm (17.7")
- The bell stack looks a bit shorter due to the camera angle
- The engraving "Waldkraiburg exclusiv" is quite common in Europe (at least in Germany, The Netherlands and Belgium). Currently there is a Waldkraiburg exclusiv (186?) for sale in Belgium. This tuba looks even better then mine and it has the plastick ball/socket linkage.
- Waldkraiburg exclusiv is also engraved on other Miraphone instruments (for example horns).
- The engraving is quite centered, however the thumb ring is not centered (optically misleading picture )
- In the Netherlands and Belgium you will find more silver tuba's (any brand) then lacquered ones (also for Miraphone). In Germany it's most common to have lacquered tuba's.
- The "pull-knob" is a water key which the previous owner had installed. He liked the fact to be able to get the water out when the tuba was standing on it's bell. I don't because it's making stains on the bell.

[Rick Denney]

- The bell is exactly 45cm (17.7")

In that case it is definitely a replacement. The valve linkages come from the mid-70's or earlier, but it wasn't until MUCH later (during the 90's, I think) that they changed the bell diameter from 420mm to 450mm.

But did they engrave the bell kranz after moving to the larger bell? Most of them now are not as wide and they are not engraved, but there is a big hole in my Miraphone lore centered on the 90's.

Rick "whose 186 has a 16.5-inch bell" Denney

[P@rick]

I don´t remeber any Miraphone instrument over here at germany with Waldkraiburg written on the bell or elsewhere.................

It appears that the netherlands received quite some different from german market instruments,remember the B&F Amati basses you came across on tjhe marktplaats site last year Patrick !!

Bohland & Fuchs Amati has never been marketed or been available here at germany,It would have been either Amati or Cerveny or even Musica,sometimes also Lignatone,all from the same mould...............

And,I´m pretty sure that that Mira is nickel plated as this kind of plating is very common to instruments in the Netherlands,it seems to suit your climatic conditions better than silver plate..............
Look seriously,a silver plated instrument always tarnishes and gets black,doesn´t it ?? This one isn´t .

I had 2 basses recently from Groningen area,both nickel plated...............

Regarding the "Exclusiv" engraving I´ll have a look at the Miraphone trade display on Frankfurt music fair in a few weeks time,to see if i can find something engraved that way.

Cheers,

Kurt

Hi Kurt,
Yes this one is nickel plated. Older "silver" instruments in the Netherlands are in most cases nickel, but nowadays it's always silver. Maybe the Waldkraiburg exclusiv engraving is something for the dutch market because I've never seen any lacquered instruments with this engraving (always nickel). And nickel was quite common before it changed to silver over here in the Netherlands. Even in the few cases where I found a Waldkraiburg exclusiv in germany (ebay) it was a nickel plated tuba, so maybe that was a tuba which found his way back home .

[P@rick]

- The bell is exactly 45cm (17.7")

In that case it is definitely a replacement. The valve linkages come from the mid-70's or earlier, but it wasn't until MUCH later (during the 90's, I think) that they changed the bell diameter from 420mm to 450mm.

But did they engrave the bell kranz after moving to the larger bell? Most of them now are not as wide and they are not engraved, but there is a big hole in my Miraphone lore centered on the 90's.

Rick "whose 186 has a 16.5-inch bell" Denney

Hi Rick,
Looks like my tuba is becoming a bit of a mystery...

[Dan Schultz]

- The bell is exactly 45cm (17.7")

In that case it is definitely a replacement. ....

Well.... maybe, Rick. What you are saying is true with the bells that have been sold here in the US as replacements. However... There's a whole 'nother World of stuff out there that us 'Yanks' have never seen!

(I still think the placement of the thumb-ring and lyre-holder in relation to the engraving is out of whack.)

[Rick Denney]

Well.... maybe, Rick. What you are saying is true with the bells that have been sold here in the US as replacements. However... There's a whole 'nother World of stuff out there that us 'Yanks' have never seen!

(I still think the placement of the thumb-ring and lyre-holder in relation to the engraving is out of whack.)

I thought about that. But I'd be willing to bet (okay, a small sum) that Miraphones in Europe were never offered with bigger bells than in the U.S. In fact, I would rather have expected the reverse, if anything.

Rick "who also thinks the engraving is centered 'differently'" Denney

[HenkEb]

I can give some more information about the *Miraphone Waldkraiburg exclusive*
I added two pictures. On off my Miraphone 188 which was played in the Dutch Metropole Orchestra from 1990 to2000
The engraving on the bell showes the triangle with Miraphone and below that: Waldkraiburg and "exclusive".

The other picture is a scan of an older Miraphone folder in Dutch which - translated in english - says:

The "" EXCLUSIVE" series is the most professional line off instruments specially made for the Netherlands and U.S.A. This serie has some kwality differences on several points in comparison with the German model.

Well ... I don't think a lot of these instruments made it to the USA , but I saw a few of them in Holland.

My 188 has standard a nickel-silver mouthpipe and trigger on 5th valve.

[HenkEb]

.... for interested people, 2 other pages from the Miraphone folder about the differences of the Exclusive series.
I think this folder is from the eighties.

[P@rick]

I can give some more information about the *Miraphone Waldkraiburg exclusive....

Thanks Henk!!! Finally, a conclusive answer. After my quest on the internet I was pretty sure it was a special build for the dutch market (also thanks to this board), but I never got a more conclusive answer than your scans show.

Somehow it’s always good to know some history about your Tuba…don’t know why… maybe it’s just me who likes to talk about facts or maybe it’s a general thing which makes people to like to talk about their equipment

…enough chat about this thing, it’s time to blow it! (Sounds silly if it wasn’t posted on a tuba site).

[bort]

There's a 3-valve Exclusiv up on the German eBay now:

http://cgi.ebay.de/Tuba-Miraphone-Waldk ... 0559607091" target="_blank