Navy vs Air Force

wooliteeuph · Post by **wooliteeuph** » Mon Nov 22, 2004 1:46 am

I'm looking for any and all information comparing and contrasting the air force bands and the navy fleet bands. I'm thinking of doing one but i just need some insight on the two to make my decision easier.

Willie

Tubadork · Post by **Tubadork** » Mon Nov 22, 2004 1:50 am

hey,
from what I understand, Air Force hires the better of the two (talent wise) and are treated the best among all the services, but promotion is slower in the AF compared at least to the Army (and the rest I think). I wish that I had joined the AF instead of the Army, but the AF does not offer a $65,000 loan repayment (and I was drowing in loan payments). You also might want to check out the AF website, last time I checked they had a freeze on hiring new musicians.
Best of luck,
Bill Pritchard

WoodSheddin · Post by **WoodSheddin** » Mon Nov 22, 2004 12:17 pm

Air Force

WoodSheddin · Post by **WoodSheddin** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 6:35 pm

cyras21 wrote:If you want the best then join the Marines.

Best fleet bands? What ya basing that one on?

Tony Halloin · Post by **Tony Halloin** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 7:35 pm

From what I understand of the difference between these two services is that for the Air Force, you would audition for the specific band that you wanted to be in, attend basic and then be stationed with that band for an indefinite period of time. In the Navy however, you would audition for the music program, attend basic training, then Navy Music school in Little Creek, VA, and be stationed at one of the various Naval installations that has a band, changing every three or so years.

I haven't heard many fleet bands from either service to speak about how well they play.

WoodSheddin · Post by **WoodSheddin** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 7:39 pm

Tony Halloin wrote:In the Navy however,

Who, in their right mind, would join the Navy, anyway?

ai698 · Post by **ai698** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 7:40 pm

Who, in their right mind, would join the Navy, anyway?

OK, I'll fall for it:

A seaman.

USStuba04 · Post by **USStuba04** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 7:40 pm

navy...

navy is the way to go...

navy offers loan repayment too... and gi bill.. and tuition assistence...and a bunch of other things...and boot camp is a breeze...

USStuba04 · Post by **USStuba04** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 8:38 pm

here is the break down in musician quality....

army... = below average and above average....
they offer the most for gi bill, loan repayment, and all the other goodys... so they get in alot of good college musicans who want to repay there loans...and alot of kids out of high school who want to go to college when they get out... a good majority of these kids dont care alot about music...plus you get army bootcamp...and you are a soldier First musicain second...

navy...= average and above average....
they offer not as much gi bill, loan repayment, and the other goodys... still get in a lot of guys out of college... who want to to repay loans..most want to make navy music a career... and the ones who dont have a degree...went to college and didnt finish...(like myself)... hardly any kids out of high school... and navy boot is easy....and you are a musician and a sailor...most MUs never see life on a ship....but you can find the oppurtunity...even then you stay out of the way....

marines...= below average and average...
they offer hardly any goodys ...so they dont get alot of musicans out of college....but the still get a few good musicains but they are far in between....and you have to go to marine boot camp...i know it is a privlage to be a marine...but unless you want to go to war...then you might not want to go there... i have a teacher who is a marine and didnt like her time in new orleans in that band...only because it was in new orleans...marines are marines first and musicians on the side ...if that makes sense....

spend one day at the navy school of music and i think you will understand....

i have a friend whos dad was in the air force and he wanted to join but he didnt like their music program so he joined the navy he is in norfolk...loves it...works about 20 - 25 hours a week...

nice..

Tubadork · Post by **Tubadork** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 9:01 pm

But,
the original post was about Navy vs. Air Force and from what I have heard about the bands from the people in the bands, Air Force is the way to go. The musical standards are higher than the Navy and you do not have to go to the crap hole (sorry, still a little bitter four years later) known as the school of music in Norfolk. If you have a music degree or have even worked on one or taken private lessons, the school is a waste of time.

Bill Pritchard

Leland · Post by **Leland** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 11:46 pm

cyras21 wrote:USStuba04 is slight off about the Marine band. It's true you are a Marine first and musician second..

The US Marine Band in DC is a whole different ball of wax from the fleet bands, though. They're not even under the command of Marine Barracks, which is where they're based.

For the fleet bands, combat zones are not an impossibility. We've got a staff sergeant (from the D&B) transferring to the Quantico band, and in a few months he'll be in the Middle East doing security -- with music on the side. He'll be fine, though, having just requalified with a 54 at the rifle range (I shot a 43 last year

...still Expert, but I wanted to get over 50).

That being said, if "doing the Marine thing" seems like it'll be fun, then a Marine unit wouldn't be a bad choice.

Anyway, back to the topic at hand...

Dean · Post by **Dean** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 7:06 am

Please do not--DO NOT compare regular marine bands to "The President's Own."

They are completely different jobs--COMPLETELY. You may as well compare being a deep sea diver and a bank teller...

I say this only to not confuse the original poster--besides, the issue was between Navy and Air Force jobs. Ohh, and I think this topic has been covered before, so make sure, if you care to, to run a search of older posts...

But, briefly, this is my understanding of the two, as i know people in both regular Navy and AF bands...

Air Force--Generally better musicians, and a more stable assignment. I am fairly certain that you COULD play your whole career at one post. At the very least, you wouldnt get moved around very much. You DO NOT have to attend any training after basic. You go to basic (which is cake Ive heard), and then straight to duty. I believe you audition for each band individually, as spots open up. Where the AF is weak is in pay. It takes a long time to get promoted. Initially, that is not that big a deal, but when it comes to spouse, kids, house, 2 dogs, and XBOX, and DISH--well, you get the idea...

Navy--Still some good musicians, but you'll probably have more weak musicians in your band as well. You will get reassigned at some point. Nice thing is, most Navy assignements are good places to live--considering you'll always be on a coast. A Navy oboist friend of mine joined up 6 years ago. She was assigned to San Diego for 2-3 years, the rest of the time she was in Hawaii--Pearl Harbor. She is also an E6 now--the same pay grade as premier band musicians. You must attend the School of Music after basic.

THere's the nutshell. Good luck.

JHardisk · Post by **JHardisk** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 10:39 am

I feel compelled to chime in. I've been in an Air Force Regional Band for just over a year now. Basic training was 6.5 weeks of unpleasantness, but not terrifically demanding. It was more irritating being away from family, and being yelled at 20 hours a day. It's not something that I wouldn't recommend to everyone. I won the audition for my job in May of '03 and shipped off to BMT in Oct '03. I knew exactly where I'd be stationed, and had gotte to know quite a few people who I'd be working with prior to my arrival. There is no Air Force music "program". You're not sent to a music school after your miltary training. I was required to participate in the drum and bugle corps at BMT, and that was painless. To enlist in the Air Force, I halted my master's degree at Indiana. Most of my collegues have at least a bachelor's degree in music, and there are quite a few masters degrees around. Only 2 doctoral degrees in progress in our squadron of just below 60 people.
The quality of musicians is rather good. I knew what I'd be accepting, musically (repetoire-wise) which is a lot of pop stuff... but that caters to the audiences that attend our shows. Every time we visit a new town, or play a concert for audiences upwards of 1500 people in the National Museum of the Air Force, one can't help but appreciate their job.

I have no complaints about the pay. When accepted into a Regional Band, you start at pay grade of E-3 (provided you have a certain amount of college credit). There is no requirement to live on base in the dorms, like the rest of people entering at your rank. Housing allowance is great, especially since we have been taken to 0& out of pocket expenses. Our facilities are great, the base is wonderful, and the hospital is unmatched by civilian ones here. I'm especially fond of this, as my first child will be delivered there in early July. If you like golfing, chances are you'll have a nicely decked out course, on base. We have 3...

I have not served in any army field bands. I do not claim to know anything about them. I will not comment on them. However, if they are any better than this job.. sign me up!

ThomasDodd · Post by **ThomasDodd** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 11:26 am

Leland wrote: That being said, if "doing the Marine thing" seems like it'll be fun, then

Then you either are off your rocker, or don't know what the "Marine thing" is...

Fun is not a word I'd use. EVER!
Semper Fi.

ThomasDodd · Post by **ThomasDodd** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 11:32 am

Dean wrote:Navy--... Nice thing is, most Navy assignements are good places to live--considering you'll always be on a coast.

Do the inland bases not have bands? Like NAS Meridian ? Naval Air Stations can be just about anywhere.

ThomasDodd · Post by **ThomasDodd** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 11:37 am

The choice really comes down to what you want to get out of the time.

Where do you want to go? Ask about possible stations, and get in touch with band members there too see if you have a chance of going there.

AF probably has better musicians, in general, but you may not like the job. Ask band members from both about their routine, and duties. Preferably somone that's been in for 8-10 years. If possible, go vist them on base for a few days. You'll learn a lot from actually watching.

Don't belive a word the recruiters tell you.

-Thomas

Dean · Post by **Dean** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 11:54 am

For the location of Navy Bands:

http://www.bupers.navy.mil/navymusic/bands.htm

Looks like there are 2 inland bands--one in IL, near Lake Michigan, and another in Memphis. The rest are coastal--and Hawaii, of course.

JHarddisk!!

Would you mind, please, letting us know the breakdown of your unit? How many E3s, E4s, E5s-E9s, etc etc etc.... Out of the 60 or so enlisted you mentioned... Also, when do most get promoted? When can you expect E4, E5? All the way up to E9?

And, can you feel confident that you will remain in Dayton the remainder of your career, should you choose to stay? Or does the AF move their musicians around regularly?

I think there are lots of people that would like to know the answers to those questions!

Thanks!

USStuba04 · Post by **USStuba04** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 11:56 am

the navy is paying out at least $35,000 for a few of the peoples school loans at the music school....

also... all in the "presidents own" are not marines.... civilians can audition for the spots and they dont go to boot camp...
and they get paid E-6 not E-7

ThomasDodd · Post by **ThomasDodd** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 12:04 pm

Dean wrote:For the location of Navy Bands:

http://www.bupers.navy.mil/navymusic/bands.htm

Looks like there are 2 inland bands--one in IL, near Lake Michigan, and another in Memphis. The rest are coastal--and Hawaii, of course.

I thoughthe navy had more bands than that. And I wish they'd dcid waht to do with NAS Memphis. I though it was basically closed now.

JCradler · Post by **JCradler** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 1:19 pm

USStuba04 wrote:the navy is paying out at least $35,000 for a few of the peoples school loans at the music school....

also... all in the "presidents own" are not marines.... civilians can audition for the spots and they dont go to boot camp...
and they get paid E-6 not E-7

Beware when you generalize; civilians do audition for spots in the President's Own, and if selected do not go to boot camp. However, we have a number of people in our ranks that moved laterally from other parts of the Marine Corps. All new members with the 9811 MOS start at E6, in that you are correct, this is also true of the other premier service bands.
As for the "not Marines" comment, it is untrue and I take great exception to it.

MGySgt John Cradler USMC
Tuba Section Leader, U.S. Marine Band