Flying with a tuba

[Rochester2013]

Hello,

There is a good chance that I might be spending my Spring semester in Vienna, Austria-with my tuba. I have never flown with a tuba, and on top of that, I have never flown in general before. I would be flying with a Miraphone 1291 with the hard MTS case. I am not sure the procedures on how to fly. Anyone want to help me figure it out?

I know that I could buy an additional seat for the instrument, is that safe, or more cost efficient (as I don't know how much it costs to fly with a tuba as 'checked baggage' in the first place)?

Thanks!
Richard

[Michael Bush]

I've never flown with a tuba, but I have flown to Germany and the Netherlands fairly recently. Each ticket is probably going to cost $800-$1200, more or less. I don't know what the baggage fee for a tuba would be, but it seems unlikely it will be as much as a seat.

But my experience is that my non-tuba luggage gets beaten up pretty badly on international flights, so maybe the seat would be worth it.

Hello,

There is a good chance that I might be spending my Spring semester in Vienna, Austria-with my tuba. I have never flown with a tuba, and on top of that, I have never flown in general before. I would be flying with a Miraphone 1291 with the hard MTS case. I am not sure the procedures on how to fly. Anyone want to help me figure it out?

I know that I could buy an additional seat for the instrument, is that safe, or more cost efficient (as I don't know how much it costs to fly with a tuba as 'checked baggage' in the first place)?

Thanks!
Richard

[Rochester2013]

Each ticket will cost about $1000 round trip. I would kind of like the peace of mind of having my tuba right next to me at all times and being in control of it, especially after dropping such a chunk of change on it recently.

[Jarrad-Bittner]

I would be very carefully even when buying a ticket. I bought a ticket to fly with my tuba when I went to ITEC this last year. On my final flight the pilot would not allow me to have the tuba on the plane, it was a smaller plane but still. Before I even went I made sure to double check that it was okay, I always made sure to ask the ticket desk too. I guess that no matter what the pilot has the final say. I was given the option to get off the plane or have the pilot take my tuba down below with all the luggage. Yes, I was already in the plane and my tuba was already buckled in. It was not until we were ready for departure that I was refused. I had no choice but to let him take it down in its soft case, I had a dress rehearsal within a few hours. I was promised a refund and a little something extra for the drama. I was never given a refund for the ticket. The tuba only had a small dent. Even after I contacted the corporate office they didn't seem to care. In the end I was able to get a small gift voucher for my trouble. Not even enough to cover the cost of checking a tuba It was Delta, BTW.

[Casey Tucker]

I've flown to philly and TSA put a decent sized dent in the bottom bow of my CC, the only horn i brought. I flew to china, all over china (5-6 more short flights), and back home with my PT in an MTS AND my old F in an anvil case. Neither of my horns were damaged in my over seas travels. In a nutshell, it's a gamble. USUALLY if there's any damage it's not beyond being fixed and I'm sure there's a repairman that can take care of it. good luck with all of your travels!

-CT

[Z-Tuba Dude]

I would be careful about using an MTS case for flight situations. I don't believe that they are designed for that sort of abuse!

[Uncle Buck]

There has been a lot of discussion about this issue that you can find in other threads.

I've read most of it, and would summarize my opinion as:

- Buying an extra seat does NOT guarantee you will be able to put your tuba in the seat. There is a possibility you will STILL have to check it, and leave the seat empty.
- I would recommend putting your money instead toward a flight case. A real flight case. Lots of threads on here about what makes a good one.

[JHardisk]

I would be careful about using an MTS case for flight situations. I don't believe that they are designed for that sort of abuse!

They are surely not designed for flight purposes. However, I just made a successful across-the-world adventure with my handmade 6450 in an MTS case. I needed a case that would make the weight limit for international travel. My issue with some of the flight cases made is that they're heavy as heck, and often too large for size restrictions for airlines.

I purchased the largest MTS case made, and modified it/added padding. This involved removing the mouthpiece box, and filling every little bit of extra space with air pillows. I had a nice wedge foam cushion (a cello chair pad) over the bell end (which was filled with a partially inflated ball), and some extra block padding in some places. I put an Altieri valve protector on the valves. This is combined with many many air pillows filling the gaps, and about 100 fragile stickers adorning the case. I babied the horn as much as TSA/international customs would let me, and sweet talked every gate checker I could to let me protect my tuba and be in as much control as possible. The tuba travelled on 7 flights without incident.

For a domestic flight, I will use a flight case (the size restrictions are often a little more flexible), but the altered MTS was awfully nice to have as an option. I seem to recall that with my 6450/2 in it, padded carefully, it only weights 52lbs.

As always, YMMV.. but I do have a success story of travelling with a good chunk of change in an "underprotected" case.

[bort]

I would recommend putting your money instead toward a flight case. A real flight case. Lots of threads on here about what makes a good one.

What I was thinking...you can get the case for about $1000 (less if used)... then each subsequent trip, it's only a few hundred for cargo fees (instead of another $1000 ticket). Not cheap, but a little better.

Maybe call Roger Lewis. I think they carry the lightweight Unitec cases that Alan Baer helped design.

[cambrook]

I would seriously investigate shipping it separately. It may well be cheaper than other means, and most companies will put the case on a pallet and strap it down. Most of the damage with normal baggage occurs when the case is thrown or dropped onto conveyors etc, with palleted cargo things are lifted by forklift.

Of course this doesn't guarantee careful handling, but there are less "link in the chain" for gorillas to mess with.

Having said that, a MTS case (with careful extra padding) going as checked baggage will *most likely* travel fine. Accidents CAN and do happen, and there are some horror stories around, but you'll *probably* be OK.

Cheers

Cam

[Rochester2013]

I am not sure if I am looking at the right carriers and such (since I have never internationally shipped anything), but it seems that with FedEx economy international shipping it would cost about $1200 for a round trip shipment of a tuba.

[Z-Tuba Dude]

I have no doubt that shipping a tuba internationally, is pretty expensive.

I think that the shipping idea is probably best done, when in between the lower 48.

[Donn]

Right, air freight is naturally going to be a bit more expensive than the ground freight option you'd probably pick for domestic transport. My experience, air freight one way from Germany to US was over $700. Things could have changed since. It's on a pallet, it's fast, and you know it will fly (as opposed to the extra seat, which as noted above is subject to the discretion of the flight crew), but of course it's expensive.

[sloan]

I've flown an MTS case a few times (zero problems) and a Yamaha case a few times (minor damage to the case - none to the tuba).

but, not doubt I've been lucky.

The way I figure it - every leg of air travel you should take a $50 bill and put it in a jar. When the time comes for dent repair, empty the jar.

right now, my jar is pretty full - but I expect to empty it eventually...in the long run.

that covers the tuba. Now the case - well, cases are supposed to get beat up. That's their job. They are the Zener-diodes of travel. Replace, as needed.

Do you feel lucky? Did the gorilla drop-kick the case 6 times, or only 5? Go ahead - make my day.

[pjv]

The problem with MTS (at least what I saw 2 years ago) is that they suffer from the same problems Conn cases always have; everythings padded and sturdy EXCEPT for the lid! Thats were the valves are. What were they thinking?

The MTS sousaphone cases, on the other hand, are relatively sturdy all the way around. I've often flown with them internationally and never had a problem (knock on wood).

Quite often a weak spot on cases are the locks. I do ALOT of traveling, so I put about 4 pieces of duct tape criss-crossed over the locks. This will never prevent it from being completely smashed, but it helps against the #1 lock killer and thats that they get hung up on all kinds of other obstacles.

A flight case is the best way to go.

Have you got some time before you have to be in Austria? Why buy a German horn here and then fly it to and from europe? Buy it there. If you go to the factory itself you can pick out your favorite tuba. Companies can always ship much cheeper than us plain folks and they'll probably help out if the horn should arrive damaged.

Of coarse you want to play the horn there. Theoretically you can't buy a horn, play it for a time, bring it back and then have the company ship it home....but....you can always ask (they'll probably say no, but they just might say yes).

I don't know what your playing on now, but if your not selling it I'd bring THAT horn. Better to ruin your #2 than your #1.

Cheers, Pat

[Jarrad-Bittner]

Delta will no longer allow people to buy a seat for instruments. I called because I was booked on a flight to London in a few weeks to check my options for my F tuba, hoping that this time I can get a seat and not be refused. Nope. The website still says you can, but the rep I spoke with verified that I cannot. Just an FYI to anyone who is going to be flying. They did tell me that they will be liable for any damage to the instrument if put underneath. I'm going to be taking a very in-depth video of the horns condition at the desk as I give it to them.

[Roger Lewis]

I recommend that you always go with the horn to the security inspection. This is where the damage can happen. Ask them if they can let YOU handle the horn. As far as they're concerned it just another bowling ball. You hold the horn while they inspect the case, you put the horn on the conveyor for the x-ray machine and pick it up afterwards. You repack it in the case with them watching and re-seal the case in their presence. Alan Baer had his horns severly damaged by the security people after advancing to the finals in NY.

All this is based on "if they'll let you".

Just my $0.02.
Roger

[sloan]

Delta will no longer allow people to buy a seat for instruments. I called because I was booked on a flight to London in a few weeks to check my options for my F tuba, hoping that this time I can get a seat and not be refused. Nope. The website still says you can, but the rep I spoke with verified that I cannot. Just an FYI to anyone who is going to be flying. They did tell me that they will be liable for any damage to the instrument if put underneath. I'm going to be taking a very in-depth video of the horns condition at the desk as I give it to them.

On the other hand, Delta has a very specific (and very tuba-friendly) PUBLISHED policy on musical instruments as baggage. I have always found them to be *very* co-operative as soon as I point out that my MTS case is *not* overweight nor oversize FOR A MUSICAL INSTRUMENT. I usually carry a printed version of the web page that states their policy. If you ask politely, you can also get "special handling" by TSA. Be sure to show up at the counter EARLY.

Note that my experience applies only to domestic flights - all bets are off on international flights, ESPECIALLY a connecting leg that starts and ends outside the USA.

Expect to pay the normal ($25?) for it as a checked bag - but they should not charge anything over and above that.

[sloan]

I recommend that you always go with the horn to the security inspection. This is where the damage can happen. Ask them if they can let YOU handle the horn. As far as they're concerned it just another bowling ball. You hold the horn while they inspect the case, you put the horn on the conveyor for the x-ray machine and pick it up afterwards. You repack it in the case with them watching and re-seal the case in their presence. Alan Baer had his horns severly damaged by the security people after advancing to the finals in NY.

All this is based on "if they'll let you".

Just my $0.02.
Roger

I always go with the case and ask if I can lock it after they inspect it. I've never asked to help them pack and unpack (and get the *strong* feeling that they have specific instructions to *not* let you do that. But, since I ask to lock it after inspection, I'm there watching them. This also gives them an opportunity to inspect *me* - and decide that I'm harmless, and so is the tuba. The most "inspection" i've ever seen is for them to open the case, exclaim at how beautiful it is, chat with me a bit about it...and then close it up again. I've *never* seen them take it out of the case. But then, I don't pack the case with lots of other stuff - everything is out in the open and visible. Other times (in places where the x-ray machines are in a public place) they run it through the x-ray and don't open the case. Once, all they did was a swab test - they never opened it. Then they ask for the keys, lock it for me, and send it on its way.

I think I get this gentle treatment because I project an attitude that says it's OK with me for them to inspect it - and I expect them to open up the case and look inside - I just want to lock the case when they are done. This tells them upfront that there's nothing dangerous inside, and I *really* care about how it is handled.
I think they get a lot of customers who yank their chains and cause friction - and then that happens, they can retaliate by going "by the book". and then...you're in deep kim-chee.

At airports where the airline takes the bags and ships them on a conveyor belt to TSA downstairs, I have discovered that there is often a TSA station "around the corner" that handles large packages. When I ask the airline personell about locking the case after inspection, I get sent there. That station is often underutilized, there's no rush, and the TSA guy welcomes company and something unusual to look at. Again - never a problem as long as you are EARLY and POLITE.

in a rush and demanding special privileges? not good.

early and compliant? how can we assist you, sir?

Your choice.

[Donn]

Delta will no longer allow people to buy a seat for instruments.

The next FAA re-authorization might have some language that supports instrument carry-on. Following is (according to an AFM site) the relevant Senate language in that bill, S.1447. The American Federation of Musicians has been lobbying for it - cf. http://www.afm.org/departments/legislat ... -airplanes

It is a sense of the House of Representatives that (1) the Under Secretary of Transportation for Security should develop security procedures to allow passengers transporting a musical instrument on a flight of an air carrier to transport the instrument in the passenger cabin of the aircraft, notwithstanding any size or other restriction on carry-on baggage but subject to such other reasonable terms and conditions as may be established by the Under Secretary or the air carrier, including imposing additional charges by the air carrier.

(I'm not sure this really address the question at all, though - it appears to be purely about security, which is I think not the issue here.)