Conn 2xJ valve alignment

[jstrother123]

My old Conn short action is in need of valve felts and I was wondering how to tell if the valves are aligned properly. I see that each of the valve shanks have a line on them, I am guessing that is an alignment mark for when the valves are not pressed. But how do you tell if they are aligned when pressed? On the finger buttons, some of them have double felts, some have a cork and a felt, so my gut tells me that there are probably some issues but I don't have any idea on how to tell for sure. Thanks.

Jim

[Wilco]

Sent an email to Bloke (Joe Sellmansberger: Midsouth music). He can set you up with synthetic felts to properly align your Conn. It did wonders for mine (25J).

[ScotGJ]

Good quality techs usually have tools to do this but I have not been able to find a tech in Western Colorado who does this (or thinks it is important to do it ). So I bought a small dental mirror and did it myself.

I found that you have to experiment with the mirror angle and use a flashlight. You pull one of the adjacent valves out and line up the mirror so you can see the port of the valve you are aligning. I had my son depress the valve I was looking at because I needed to direct the light precisely with one hand and the mirror with the other.

Dental mirrors come in different sizes with smaller numbers meaning smaller size. I have a #5 that works in my 4/4 Nirschl valve casings. I think a #5 is around 17-18mm. I found the mirror and size charts through Google. I don't know what sizes would work for your horn but it should be pretty easy to figure.

You may only be able to see half (the bottom in my case) of the port so you may need to add and subtract felts until you see where you are for both directions.

I can look up a tuning slide and see my 4th valve on my horn for alignment and those distances were close for the other valves, but with the mirror I found that my third valve required a slight change for exact alignment.

Another way is to make very exact measurements of all distances involved and calculate the size of the felts but in my case I am pretty sure the mirror method was quicker--and involved less thinking .

Ask questions if I have not been clear--this method works for my horn but I do not have a 2Xj to look at to see if the same applies for your horn--Cheers.

[SousaSaver]

Take your horn to a tech. It will be cheaper for you to do this than to buy a dental tool, light or bore scope and felts, cork or neoprene to align your valves yourself.

[Michael Bush]

If I lived closer to one of the learned pros on this board, I'd be their regular customer. But I don't.

So I took my Conn to the local tech for valve alignment right after I got it. For several weeks I didn't question his work. But I had some mighty funny intonation quirks. And most of the mid-range was stuffy and hard to slot. At first I thought it was just an old horn played by a guy with limited skills. (Both of those are still true, by the way.)

I started poking around. The long and short of it is that the tech had stuck 1/8" thick felts under the valve buttons and under the caps and called it a day.

So I got a book written for band directors that explained how to do this job, bought a little sheet of neoprene on the Internet, went out to my shop where I had the other things I needed, and followed the instructions.

Now I have a nice, free blowing, in-tune mid-range, and a new skill. Very doable.

[Dan Schultz]

Piston alignment on a 2Xj is critical. There just isn't much of a 'land' between the ports.

First... you've gotta do the obvious...

- Make sure all of your fingerbuttons are the same.
- Check the length of the pistons stems. They have to be the same.
- See that your casing caps seat the way as they should.

I see more horns with mixed parts than you can imagine! Sometimes, fingerbuttons will look the same on the outside but have an 'step' built into the underside.

As far as I'm concerned, a borescope is the only way to go. 'Feelers' and mirrors are OK but I like to actually see what is going on.

[SousaSaver]

It can be done at home. It is just more convenient to take it somewhere. There isn't any harm or real risk in doing your own valve alignment BUT someone who is good at it will be able to align your valves with a pretty high degree of precision. Plus, you may discover something that might be causing your horn to play stuffy that has nothing to do with the alignment.

[ScotGJ]

There are places in the US where a reliable tech is not within 100 miles (240 in my case--as far as I have been able to determine). If you have a reliable tech, then by all means--use a skilled tech.

[Dan Schultz]

There are places in the US where a reliable tech is not within 100 miles (240 in my case--as far as I have been able to determine). If you have a reliable tech, then by all means--use a skilled tech.

I understand. As mentioned earlier is this thread.... IF you are fairly certain the horn contains all of the original valve parts (stems, fingerbuttons, etc.).... you can have Bloke send you a set of his synthetic felts.

[Phil Dawson]

Bill Ford at Flesher Hinton in Denver is very good. Flesher used to have quite strong ties with WSC in Gunnison so you might inquire to see if they are going to be At WSC for an honor band or brass band workshop at some point. They used to always bring a repair person to those functions but not always a brass person. Often it would be Barry their shop head honcho and he might be able to do the job for you. If You set up a time quite a ways in advance Bill may be able to get you in and out in 1 day if he knows you are coming from out of town. If he does this a tip (quietly under the table) never hurts, Good Luck, Phil

[SousaSaver]

Bloke is correct, except the distances aren't always perfect or your measuring device won't be good enough. This will put you in the ball park but the best results will come from using a scope or a huge dental inspection mirror. I have one that I use that is a perfect size for Tubas and Sousas. I can use this mirror and an LED light when I don't have access to my scope.

It is important to be very accurate on these horns because of the shape of the ports. The sound and response really opens up when they are aligned properly.

[SousaSaver]

The only problem you might encounter is finding a cork tube (or cork washers) with a huge hole that will accommodate a 20K valve stem.

I have this problem frequently. I usually use a drill in my bench motor at a slow speed to make the hole a smidge bigger.

Why did Conn use such a BIG diameter rod for their threads on the 2XJ/20K buttons? I almost always have to replace 1 or 2 on each used one I get because the stem is flared out and split open at the threads.

[jstrother123]

Thanks everybody for your reply's and hints. They were all very helpful and hopefully and get this monster sounding even better.

Jim