Age of King Eb Helicon

[Z-Tuba Dude]

Hi folks,

I have just aquired a King Eb Helicon from Dan Schultz (Thanks Dan!).

I am having some difficulty in trying to figure out the age of the instrument. It is a a "King" manufactured by H.N White, in Cleveland, Ohio.

Here is what it looks like:

King Helicon small.jpg

The serial number is 373XX, which according to Lars Kirsmer's site would place it at approximately 1909 (my estimate).

So far, so good....BUT....the King catalogs that are online seem to contradict that!

Here is the drawing of the Eb helicon from the 1919 catalog:

1919%20BBb%20Helicon%20Large.jpg

Here is the 1924 catalog:

1924%20BBb%20Helicon%20Bass%20Large.jpg

My dilemma is that the valve tubing configuration most closely matches the 1924 catalog picture, in spite of the low serial number.

Can anybody share some insight as to the actual age of the instrument???

Thanks![/b]

[windshieldbug]

To start with, the White serial lists available are not accurate for this vintage, as you suggest.

Just to start, I'm sure that the engraving on the bell reads "The H.N. White Co.", which means that it is at least newer than 1918, not 1909.
The 1919 picture, by the engraving, must pre-date 1918.
My current estimation for your horn, by the serial number and backed up by the illustrations, is 1918-1920.

[Dan Schultz]

I made that helicon out to be a model 1225 manufactured probably in 1935. That's from the table in the Allied Catalog. It's a King ... made by H. N. White in Cleveland. It can't be older than 1925 (I don't think, anyway)>

[windshieldbug]

I made that helicon out to be a model 1225 manufactured probably in 1935. That's from the table in the Allied Catalog. It's a King ... made by H. N. White in Cleveland. It can't be older than 1925 (I don't think, anyway)>

"H.N. White", or "H.N.White Co."? I've documented "Co."'s as far back as 32235...

[Z-Tuba Dude]

"H.N. White", or "H.N.White Co."? I've documented "Co."'s as far back as 32235...

The bell says:

King
made by
The H.N. White Co.
Clev. D.
O.

[imperialbari]

]
Clev. D.
O.

I get the Cleveland and the Ohio references, but what does the D. refer to?

Klaus

[Dan Schultz]

]
Clev. D.
O.

I get the Cleveland and the Ohio references, but what does the D. refer to?

Klaus

I have a bell here engraved the same way... "Clev, D" with an "O." under. That's a comma between the "Clev" and the "D". It must just be a goofy way of abbreviating the name of the city. Lazy engraver on that day!