Mouthpiece for a bass trombone

finnbogi · Post by **finnbogi** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 11:00 am

I have just acquired an old(ish) bass trombone, which I would like to try and use alongside my tuba. The horn in question is a Conn 71H, on which the slide is in good condition (as far as I know). It does, however, not have a mouthpiece.
Can any of you bass'bone doublers recommend a mouthpiece for this horn? In particular, are there more than one possible shank sizes in the bass trombone part of the forest of mouthpieces and if so, which one would fit the 71H?

Thanks in advance,
Finnbogi

Joe Baker · Post by **Joe Baker** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 11:31 am

Inexpensive and widely available starting points are Schilke 59 or 60, or Bach 1 or 1.5 G. If and when you achieve a level where you feel constrained by your mouthpiece (I played bassbone almost exclusively for about six years on a Schilke 60, and never found a situation where the mp was my problem), you will find a larger pool of trombone opinions at http://www.trombone.org

Good luck!
_________________________________
Joe Baker, who has been getting the itch to play bass bone again more and more often lately.[/url]

AndyCat · Post by **AndyCat** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 11:49 am

Somewhere along the lines of a schilke 59 or 60, I use a Doug Yeo Signature.

manatee · Post by **manatee** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 11:57 am

Get a Faxx 1.5., roughly $18.00. A good starting point from which you can go up, down or stay put.

NeilD · Post by **NeilD** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 1:08 pm

I have found that a Warburton 1B is a good one for those accustomed to a larger rim. The backbore and throat are a bit smaller than a Bach 1G and it produces a brighter tone. It plays easier in the higher ranges than a 1G. I believe that the 1B may be the largest cup diameter available, and it surprised me that it felt smaller due to a sharper rim contour than the Bach.

Liberty Mo · Post by **Liberty Mo** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 3:06 pm

I find that a Marcinkowitz 105 Phil Teele Model is an ideal Bass Trombone mouthpiece, plenty of mouthpiece to sing low, but the rim allows for very sharp attack, its light on the chops too.

smurphius · Post by **smurphius** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 5:21 pm

As a tuba player, my bass tromboning makes me a lot more money in life. I personally also use the Schilke 60. Very large, but very comfortable for me. Helps me produce a very large, full, and fat sound. Good for orchestral and jazz playing if used properly. This item can be yours for the small price of.....

Oh sorry.

For a second I thought I was hosting The Price is Right.

I hate when that happens.

MartyNeilan · Post by **MartyNeilan** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 5:57 pm

Check out the larger Griegos, specifically the Deco .75 and .5 (.25 is a little TOO big, a specialty piece) They are around the size of the 60 but more responsive and better high register. The Yeo was a much improved 60, and many of the bass bonists I know are converting from their Yeo to the Griego .5 or .75. I have found the Schilke 59 and Bach 1 1/2 to be small enough to cause major issues with my tuba chops when switching back and forth. The Griegos are even more comfortable than the Yeo and make switching a breeze. I used a .5 and a .75 for a number of orchestral and big band gigs last year; I have settled on the .75 as it is slightly more centered.
http://www.griegomouthpieces.com

P.S. I am sincere about the pieces and not trying to sell you mine, as I will only ship within the US.

Captain Sousie · Post by **Captain Sousie** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 7:00 pm

It's a little bit small, but a Wick 1AL worked for me and it didn't mess with my chops too much.

Sousie

ken k · Post by **ken k** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 7:52 pm

I find that most tuba and euph players who double on bass bone tend to sound very "woofy" and do not have the centered tone and clear artix which a trombone should have (even the bass trombone). You do not want to sound like a tuba on a stick. You want to blend with the tenor trombones in the section. So I would suggest you start with a Bach (or Faxx) 1 1/2 and if you really feel constrained after working on this for a while, then go to a larger size. The 1 1/2 is fairly small by today's standards although for many decades it was the standard piece.

If you want to go lareger, you could go with the Bach 1 1/4 or even the 1, or go into the Schilke line of a 59 or 60 which has been suggested. The Schilke rims tend to be more rounded and thinner and for some are harder to center in. Like bloke I too use a 59 for most of my bass boning. I was a bass bone major in college and grad school and doubled on tuba; now I play more tuba. I never felt comfortable on larger mouthpieces like the 60, even when I was practicing bass bone regularly. They are great below the staff, but in the staff and above they make the horn sound too much like Euphoniums. Don't get me wrong Euphonium is a beautiful instrument but a trombone should not sound like one. I never used a Yeo model but have heard lots of great things about it. Some of these mouthpeices like the Yamaha Yeo model and Griegos can get a bit pricey (well over $100) and if you are just starting out and trying to find your way, they may be overkill. So you are better off sticking to the basics right now.

I am very intrigued by the stainless steel mouthpieces both for tuba and bassbone and may be looking at trying some of those but I am not a novice and would not recommend them for you at this time.

ken k

ken k · Post by **ken k** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 8:03 pm

bloke wrote:bloke "who doesn't believe that many primarily bass 'bone players use a Schilke 59 mouthpiece"

A few years back I had the pleasure of hearing the Navy Commodores Big Band at our Berks Jazz Fest here in PA. The bass bone player was awesome. Unfortunatley I can not remember his name now. You could always hear him and it was always tasty and just right, not too much but just right (of course I am a bit biased). Anyway after the gig I went back stage to talk to him and told him how much I enjoyed hearing him and how his sound was always right there. I asked how he got that sound? He said he "only" used a Shilke 59 and a standard Bach 50B2 and he felt the sound on this "smaller" equipment is what made his sound cut through the band. Of course that is a bit of a different sound concept than an orchestral player would probably have, but it made sense, and I have used that concept in my own playing, since I am more of a big band type than an orchestral type. But I too use a 59 and for most ensemble and band type playing, I feel it is overkill to use anything larger. If I play some big band stuff and trombone quartet stuff that is pedal note city I may break out the 60, but most of the time I am very happy on my 59.

ken "bigger is not always better" k

Mudman · Post by **Mudman** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 8:42 pm

I would like to echo what several people have already written: Schilke 59 or 60 when doubling on bass bone. (Start with the 59) Also Bach 1-1/2G or 1G.

The Schilke mouthpieces have a bit of a "cookie-cutter" rim. Very thin. Bach rims are wider. The thin rim on a Schilke mouthpiece is only an issue for some players when performing advanced solo-literature.

Most of the tuba students I have worked with get the best sound on a Schilke 59 when playing bass trombone.

These mouthpieces are all tried-and-true standards. They work for many people on many horns. The custom setups are great (Doug Elliot) but a player probably needs to have developed their chops before it is productive to experiment with the many options available.

When I started doubling on tuba, I made the mistake of starting out with a PT88 for everything. It worked but everthing sounded a bit fuzzy. This would be the equivalent of using a bored out Schilke 60 or specialty mouthpiece on bass bone. Life is indeed easier with smaller equipment.

smurphius · Post by **smurphius** » Mon Jan 31, 2005 9:29 pm

Daring to go toward's the gutter here...

Smaller equipment is not always a woman's preference. Then again, neither are trombone and tuba players! I always KNEW there was a reason that the "COMPENSATING" horn was created. LOL.

I think my purdy lady likes me because of my equipent. I mean, who wouldn't love having tubas and trombones lying around the house?? What? Huh! What were you thinking when I said equipment. SHAMEY SHAMEY.

(Feel free to send hate messages for this. I just COULDN'T resist. HAH)

Ames0325 · Post by **Ames0325** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 1:24 am

Don't get me wrong Euphonium is a beautiful instrument but a trombone should not sound like one.

Perhaps I am mistaken or perhaps I hven't heard enough good low brass playing, but euph and bass bone sound nearly the same to me. Perhaps I am missing something?

Amy

chhite · Post by **chhite** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:26 am

I've hade great success with my Laskey 85MD on my Bach 50BLG. It's equivalent to a 1 & 1/4 G. For me, the rim is more comfortable than the Bach and I can play longer with a more consistant sound. Laskey's web site calls the 85MD "an ideal solo bass trombone mouthpiece." Judge for yourself.

Mudman · Post by **Mudman** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 8:25 am

bloke wrote:
Perhaps I am mistaken or perhaps I hven't heard enough good low brass playing, but euph and bass bone sound nearly the same to me. Perhaps I am missing something?

euphonium = "sounds like a musical saw"

bass trombone = "sounds like a chainsaw"

Tell that to John Rojak! His playing in the American Brass Quintet is proof that bass trombone is the ideal bottom voice in a brass quintet.

Seriously, not every orchestra allows chainsaw playing along with four breaths on final notes, complete with fz re-attacks during said last-note.

finnbogi · Post by **finnbogi** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 9:12 am

Thanks for your replies.
As for the shanksize, should all these mouthpieces fit the Conn 71H?

TubeNet

Mouthpiece for a bass trombone

Mouthpiece for a bass trombone

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