Willson 2960 Tuning Trigger

[PMeuph]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggXmKPMaHMo" target="_blank

[Amilcare]

I'm sorry to have been so cross.

There is no smugness. Only a lifetime that includes Special Band membership and a lot of experience.

To my knowledge, few of the Special Band members add a tuning contraption to their equipment. The really important part of what I wrote was lost.

Mechanics matter little. If a player like a Herserh or Pokorny rides a slide - fine.

Another story: Herseth's basement in Oak Park is festooned with "green" trumpets sent for his approval. He can and does pick one up occasionally to demonstrate for a student. It still is the same as the matched set of Bach trumpets he kept downtown.

[Amilcare]

The point I was making is that if one knows the right note, he'll play it.

Jay started as a euph player and plays trombone very well by lipping notes in tune as do most sophisticated euph players.

The problem is that all the tools and mechanics will never replace a musician who knows the right note before he must play it. This includes all of the special adjustments one needs to essay just temperament, the tuning of professionals.

I hope this clarifies my thoughts. Great players will be great. Tools can only help those who know how to use them. Crutches help if you have a broken leg, but it's a terrible way to learn to walk.

[Amilcare]

I see one of the posters here has a 3-valve compensating Besson. The disappearance of this instrument has been due to idiot teachers who see pros with 4-valve and insist all of their students have them.

These horns need serious work to be useful. 98.7% of band literature does not require the extra range, and 99.999% of public school students never play them correctly.

Choosing one of these instruments is demanding.

BTW, I was in Paris at the Garde Republicaine band. Sadly, their horns are compensating Saxhorns. I was hoping they might have kept the old horns.

[PMeuph]

I see one of the posters here has a 3-valve compensating Besson. The disappearance of this instrument has been due to idiot teachers who see pros with 4-valve and insist all of their students have them.

These horns need serious work to be useful. 98.7% of band literature does not require the extra range, and 99.999% of public school students never play them correctly.

Choosing one of these instruments is demanding.

BTW, I was in Paris at the Garde Republicaine band. Sadly, their horns are compensating Saxhorns. I was hoping they might have kept the old horns.

In my opinion, the 3-valve compensator is one of the best horns out there. It is the perfect parade horn. (Light, in tune, good even tone, no quirky notes, easy high range) I have only encountered one or two situations where an arranger had put a low Eb (I played it up the octave.)

In Canada, because instrument companies have less presence in the market, horns are usually more expensive. As such, schools usually can't afford "pro" horns. I have never seen a local middle school or high school with anything else than a YEP-201 or YEP-321. (In 2004, I was quote $11,000 for a YEP-842s at a local(back then) music store, the YEP-321 was just over $3000 with taxes.) I waited several years and bought all my horns online.

[tclements]

I have a GREAT trigger set up on my Hirsbrunner euph. If you want photos, email me offline - ttuba@comcast.net" target="_blank

[oldbandnerd]

I play a 1976 Boosey&Hawkes Imperial 3+1 compnesator. I wish I had a tuning trigger on it. It has some intonation quirks that I can't overcome.
- My concert pitch Eb(top staff line) can be very,very sharp and I will pull the 1st valve tuning slide ( yup ... just like a tuba player) out when I can just to play that one note. It has to go back in or it will throw off the other notes played on that valve. I know this is one of those notes that can be off on a euphonium but it seems to be really bad for me. I have never been able to determine if it just me or the horn. I just make the adjustment and live with it.

- I also have to play concert pitch G on 3rd instead of the 1/2 combination to play it in tune. I leave the 3rd valve slide pulled all the time because I don't use it hardley at all and it doesn't affect anything else. Again,I am not sure if the problem is me or the horn ... I just pull the slide and live with it.

In this video of Ken C. Wood playing his Imperial you can see him using a 1st slide trigger ( at 2:13 ). I wouldn't mind having one of those on mine.It do it for me !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JjZJwyg ... re=related" target="_blank

[Bob Kolada]

Oldbandnerd, playing it 4 or 13 might fix that Eb. Not ideal but at least it's a simple punch buttons solution...

[PMeuph]

I play a 1976 Boosey&Hawkes Imperial 3+1 compnesator. I wish I had a tuning trigger on it. It has some intonation quirks that I can't overcome.
- My concert pitch Eb(top staff line) can be very,very sharp and I will pull the 1st valve tuning slide ( yup ... just like a tuba player) out when I can just to play that one note. It has to go back in or it will throw off the other notes played on that valve. I know this is one of those notes that can be off on a euphonium but it seems to be really bad for me. I have never been able to determine if it just me or the horn. I just make the adjustment and live with it.

- I also have to play concert pitch G on 3rd instead of the 1/2 combination to play it in tune. I leave the 3rd valve slide pulled all the time because I don't use it hardley at all and it doesn't affect anything else. Again,I am not sure if the problem is me or the horn ... I just pull the slide and live with it.

G is suppose to be 3, 1-2 will always be sharp. The companies that design fingering charts are wrong. (The logic behind my statement is as follows. 2 is a semi tone of Bb, 1 is a full tone. but for acoustical reasons 1 tone plus 1/2 tone do not equal 1.5 tone.However 3 is equal to 1.5 tones. (the length of 1+2 is shorter than the total length of 3)see: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=36275&start=12#p318369" target="_blank

As Bob stated,stated 1+3 or 4 might work. I have used 1+4 often and don't find it too bad (I played F with 4) (I played on a 74 imperial)

[tclements]

I really don't like using 'alternate' fingerings, especially on euphonium. I'd rather play the 'natural' fingerings and use a simple tuning jigger to adjust the length of the instrument so that I am always playing the 'note the horn wants to play.'

[tclements]

@ Bloke - I would say that is true for many American built instruments. I would think, though, this is to compensate for players using 1 & 3 for c and 1-2-3 for b. My experience is that the European builders (especially on rotary tubas) make the 3rd slide the 'right' length for a true minor 3rd. I could be wrong ...

[tclements]

That is precisely I like a main slide jigger. ALL slide positions are a compromise.

[Mark]

I would say that is true for many American built instruments. I would think, though, this is to compensate for players using 1 & 3 for c and 1-2-3 for b. My experience is that the European builders (especially on rotary tubas) make the 3rd slide the 'right' length for a true minor 3rd. I could be wrong ...

I tend to agree and have been told by a Miraphone rep that they expect you to use 3 instead of 1+2.

[PMeuph]

That is precisely I like a main slide jigger. ALL slide positions are a compromise.

On my Yamaha, the only note I have found somewhat quirky is the D above the staff, it is too flat. (I play it with 3 and that seems to get it right on)

I think a tuning lever on this horn would be a waste of my money. The same goes for my $500 3-valver. On a Hirshbrunner, a Willson, a Sovereign, I can see why someone would want a trigger.

[Rick F]

Christopher,

Gail Robertson is now back with Willson, but on a 2950 model instead of the 2900. She had a trigger added to her horn, but not sure who did the work. She told me she got used to a trigger while she was playing the York Eminence... said it's nice to just buzz on center and not to have to lip any notes. You might try contacting her to find out where she had the trigger installed.

http://gailrobertson.com/