Ripping off?

[tuneitup]

Hi guys,

TubeNetters always have a lot of intellectual/interesting opinions, and I was wondering what do you guys think of this. Basically, the article is saying that the orchestra piece by a grammy winning composer sounds just like a piece by another composer. You can compare the two pieces at the bottom of the page.

http://conductingmasterclass.wordpress. ... -sidereus/

[averagejoe]

Thanks for the links, interesting reading and listening.
I think that the two pieces are definitely too close for comfort- very similar.

[bearphonium]

This has produced some interesting conversations around town (I live in Eugene; missed the performance due to a family commitment)...I will add new developments as they come in.

[Todd S. Malicoate]

I've played with Brian McWhorter in a festival orchestra the last two summers. He's a man of utmost integrity. If he says the new piece is a copy of the other, you can bet your last dollar on that.

[KiltieTuba]

And? Doesn't everyone rip off each other? Doesn't a lot of what John Williams has written sound like stuff from other composers?

[ShoelessWes]

And? Doesn't everyone rip off each other? Doesn't a lot of what John Williams has written sound like stuff from other composers?

Dvorak/Jaws?

[bloke]

And? Doesn't everyone rip off each other? Doesn't a lot of what John Williams has written sound like stuff from other composers?

I find Williams' music to be more self-identifiable (tonally/melodically) than that composed by Bruckner.

bloke "who senses quite a bit of envy expressed by government composers regarding Williams' freelance success and celebrity"

[tuneitup]

Well, if you listen to it, you might see that this is more than just resembling another piece. It is more like a re-orchestration, and it lasts several minutes of the piece. I'd say it is a lot more than what I notice from John Williams.

[ginnboonmiller]

government composers

Where can I sign up for the government composers program? That sounds awesome.


I haven't heard the two pieces yet, and looking at the page of the score in that blog post, I'm not sure I'm interested, but appropriation and theft are two different things, and it can be really, really tough to judge the difference sometimes. From what I gather, this could be either theft or the creative appropriation of the first composer's material, and since the guy credits the first composer for generating the melody, I'm inclined to lean towards the latter. That's without judging the quality of the guy's work. It can be boringly uncreative and derivative without being straight up theft, no problem. The same way that Kenny G's music being awful doesn't keep it from being jazz.


John William's music is terrible. So is the music of a lot of student composers I hear, who are paying a lot of money for the opportunity to make terrible music. How much he makes doesn't bother me one whit. The fact that his music is abominable and ubiquitous bothers me a lot.

[bloke]

I didn't say that I "like" John Williams' music. I own no John Williams music recordings. The only time I ever listen to it is when I'm paid to play it.

I DID, though, say this:

I find Williams' music to be more self-identifiable (tonally/melodically) than that composed by Bruckner.

bloke "which is the topic of the thread"

[ginnboonmiller]

I didn't say that I "like" John Williams' music. I own no John Williams music recordings. The only time I ever listen to it is when I'm paid to play it.

I DID, though, say this:

I find Williams' music to be more self-identifiable (tonally/melodically) than that composed by Bruckner.

bloke "which is the topic of the thread"

I was pretty clearly remarking about the "envy" spiel in your sig, yeah? If you can be 80/20 on topic, so can I.

Of COURSE I want John Williams' money. I also think his music is terrible. That isn't envy, though. It's a combination of greed and good taste.

[Rick Denney]

And? Doesn't everyone rip off each other? Doesn't a lot of what John Williams has written sound like stuff from other composers?

I find Williams' music to be more self-identifiable (tonally/melodically) than that composed by Bruckner.

bloke "who senses quite a bit of envy expressed by government composers regarding Williams' freelance success and celebrity"

I'm there. I've heard that his music sounded like Dvorak, but also Holst and several other composers.

There has never been a composer that didn't sound like some other composer for at least some of their work. That's the reason we can generally group music into historical categories. Can all of us really tell the difference between Mozart and Haydn, if we've never heard either work before?

Rick "not doubting that Williams will figure prominently in the musical history of this period, after the academic complaints about it have faded into obscurity" Denney