bio oil

[Ben]

I've never heard of it, but can barely read from the pic it is marked for brass instruments... Is it plant (certain plants have been cultivated as petroleum substitutes) or animal based? If it is biodegradable, does this equate to food for bacteria? Joe, how long have you tried this stuff, and have you noticed any consequences other than the viscosity?

I am perfectly happy with my cheap petroleum based lubricants.

Haven't tried it, but curious about those who would use it.

[PaulTkachenko]

I've got some - it seems to last a while but apart from that, nothing remarkable.

[bort]

FWIW, Alan Baer gave a testimonial for the stuff on the manufacturer's Web page. No clue about the stuff myself, but Baer's name sure seems to help sell G&W mouthpieces and MW tubas...

[bort]

Wow, that's crazy. Well, I wasn't quite taking it that far... how about "I hear Alan Baer uses it, you could ask him." eeh?

[cambrook]

I tried it, it was a long time ago and I soon gave up on it. From memory I agree it was a bit too thick, and it didn't work as well as Hetmans etc for me.

I support sensible environmental measures, but I don't see that brass instrument lubricants have any adverse impact - we're not talking about bio-diesel here......

Cheers

Cam

[tubalamb]

It's a canola based oil with lemon essence for smell (flavoring?).

I tried it for a bit on my 4/4 Nirschl. Love the idea of a bio oil, but this one didn't work for me. It was okay, but I think your assumption about being a "wee bit slow" was right. It especially seemed sluggish on a cold horn. Warmer weather and a warmer horn were a bit better, but still a bit slow for me. I've since moved to something else for my valve oil needs.

[iiipopes]

Damn. Too gimmicky. Too much money. If a player needs a thicker valve oil, then add a drop at a time of pharmaceutical grade mineral oil to a regular one-ounce bottle of valve oil (shaking for dispersion each time) until the desired viscosity is reached. And if the player wants lemon, or lime, or any other aroma for that matter, then the essence/spice aisle at the grocery store has all the flavors, and since they are oil based, also add a drop at a time until the desired intensity of aroma is obtained.

Thanks, but I'll stick with my Roche'-Thomas.

[imperialbari]

Should be less hazardous to the suckers among brass players than mineral based lubricants.

[cambrook]

That reminds me of the very smelly grease that was recommended for tuning slides by the same person who recommended bio-oil to me. It was for wheel bearings on boat trailers. I'm sure it's a wonderful grease for that application, but it was wrong in every way for my tubas.....

[Donn]

I would sure not use canola oil in my tuba. Vegetable oils oxidize and polymerize, beginning with a rancid smell, moving to a sticky/gummy phase and possible ending pretty near a solid resin. I wouldn't doubt that there are things they might do, starting with canola oil, to make a more stable lubricant, but it would be worth checking.

[Highpitch]

I use Hetman's Classic with a few drops of STP mixed in on my 1918 Hawkes & Son's really worn plungers....

DDG

[MikeW]

I have seen other threads (along the lines of how do you un-stick a slide) which mentioned as a side issue that you shouldn't use vegetable lubricants because they go tacky, then eventually set like paint, and you shouldn't use animal lubricants because they either rot and stink, or harden like glue - basically, stay with petroleum based lubricants or artificial paraffins.

I guess the question is, can anyone predict what would happen if you lube up an instrument with this new stuff, then put it away in the store-room for a year ?

[Donn]

I guess the question is, can anyone predict what would happen if you lube up an instrument with this new stuff, then put it away in the store-room for a year ?

Two points about your question: 1. only need to expose it to oxygen, whether stored or not, and 2. you would get a more useful prediction from someone who really knows something about this stuff, as opposed to "anyone." Obviously I have an opinion myself, but I'm more in the "anyone" category.

I did look up their web site, and among the tips: "It is recommended that you clean your instrument as you normally would every two weeks or so to prevent build-up."

So I guess the question is, how do we normally clean our instruments every two weeks? Do we happen to use solvents or detergents of any kind while doing this, that would effectively remove old vegetable oil? (I have to ask, because frankly I don't clean my instrument every two weeks, but I knew anyway that I am not normal.)

(Hot lye solution will certainly do it, in case anyone's looking for a vegetable oil remover.)

[JCalkin]

Bloke,

I received a bottle from my wife who got some at TMEA thinking it would be neat to try.

I hate it.

Like you, I found the action to be quite slow, when compared to my make-it-yourself lamp oil plus 3-in-1. Also, I found that it gets gummy and leaves a build-up over time, requiring more frequent cleanings.

I'm a fan of the added cleaning benefit petroleum based oils give (since they act as a fairly good solvent). I'd rather clean LESS, not MORE.

The bottle is now a couple of years old and I just gave it the sniff test, and (yup) it's starting to smell rancid.

[Dan Schultz]

' time to flood the instrument with lamp oil and flush out all of this stuff, I guess.

+1

[Lectron]

' time to flood the instrument with lamp oil and flush out all of this stuff, I guess.

+1

[tokuno]

Has anyone (besides me) tried this out?

. . . I'm thinking it may be just a bit too viscous for large-surface-area (aka "big valve") tuba pistons. Yeah, I believe I might be observing that my valves may be a wee bit slow with this concoction . . .

. . . bloke "If there is a market, I wouldn't mind stocking/selling it...but I'm not as sure about using it."

a partially-used bottle was included with a B&H baritone I bought along with a strong recommendation from the seller.

Tried it, thought it was a bit sluggish, replaced it with Hetman's. Wouldn't buy it.

[MikeW]

I guess the question is, can anyone predict what would happen if you lube up an instrument with this new stuff, then put it away in the store-room for a year ?

Two points about your question: 1. only need to expose it to oxygen, whether stored or not, and 2. you would get a more useful prediction from someone who really knows something about this stuff, as opposed to "anyone." Obviously I have an opinion myself, but I'm more in the "anyone" category.

1. only need to expose it to oxygen, whether stored or not
Probably true. I mentioned the storeroom because that may be the worst case, with the instrument being set aside and not played for months. If the instrument was played at all, the player would notice when it started to gum up, and (probably) would clean the gum out. I was also remembering someone's war story about a band teacher who oiled all his brass instruments with cooking oil before putting them away for the Summer, and ended up with a bunch of stuck you-name-its.

2. you would get a more useful prediction from someone who really knows something about this stuff
Of course. But this is a chat forum, so I left it open for anyone to join in and share their experience. An expert opinion would obviously be doubly welcome.

For what it's worth, someone mentioned that this stuff is just thinly disguised Canola oil. I tried Canola oil in one of those pump-up spray cans (in the kitchen, not the tuba); I didn't use it much, and it gummed up in less than a month - I guess the commercial stuff stays liquid because the propellant doesn't contain oxygen.