ALTERNATUBA

The bulk of the musical talk
tubajoe
pro musician
pro musician
Posts: 589
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:51 pm
Location: NYC
Contact:

ALTERNATUBA

Post by tubajoe »

Ok folks, it's time...

This is an offshoot of the thread that ended up about me, which I’ll admit kinda floored me... I do my thing, but I want to tell you there is an ENTIRE SECT of professional tuba players out there who are all but unnoticed by the tuba mainstream who are deep in the trenches creating their own paths and finding new ways to apply the tuba. I’m not talking about any specific genre or type of player, I’m merely talking about players who have decided to take the leap OFF of the written page and leave reproduction behind.

This group is growing exponentially, and I want to make sure you know their names.
You should know who these players are. They deserve the tuba community’s recognition, and more importantly the tuba community’s support.


I’ll start by saying this list is only the tip of the iceberg -- there's no way I could mention them all, so I'm going start and focus on players JUST IN NEW YORK ALONE.... and I’m sure that there are some I’ve missed (apologies for those who should be added, I can go back and edit afterwards), I’m must musing this off of the top of my head. And this does not include the many wonderful more conventional players in the city. I’m merely listing players who I know for a fact are digging in and discovering new directions of their own.

Off the top of my head, I can count at least four generations...

There’s the “Varsity” as HoJo calls it... You know many of these folks... Howard Johnson, Bob Stewart, Joe Daley, Earl McIntyre, Dave Bargeron... those guys not only invented unique ways to apply the tuba (all of them are very different players!!) they pushed MUSIC in a very hard direction... from jazz to free jazz (which goes alongside classical chamber music) to funk, to R&B and rock. (did you know HoJo was working with John Lennon at the time of Lennon’s death?) Joe Daley is also probably one of the most beautiful sounding sousaphone players around with a unique and sweet style all his own. Add to this is Philly’s Jonathan Dorn who also did so much. In town there’s also Jack Jeffers and Ralph Hamperian, and the charming Art Baron who plays sousaphone for that one boss guy... Bruce Springsteen.

And there is the generation before them... Don Butterfield and Bill Barber, and let’s throw Ray Draper in this group too -- while rough, Ray was amazingly brave and searching for something that I think he was able to touch upon. Ray is still legendary up here in my neighborhood of Harlem, where HoJo, Bob Stewart, and myself all live a few blocks from each other.

There then is another generation, the generation before me -- players like Marcus Rojas who really champions the avant-garde and it’s relation to other genres. There’s also of course Sam Pilafian (including him because he is a former New York guy!) and his application of taking sheer virtuosity in many directions. Jay Rozen is a part of this group too, a guy with insane chops and a fierce curiosity. Cant forget Jay’s Yale contemporary, John Stevens (also former New York guy). There’s the amazing Ray Stewart, and a guy named Dave Hofstra who is a current NYC staple, as well as Dave Grego and Jose Davila and Clark Gayton, all who both have done and continue to do interesting things.

Then there’s these guys - not all NYC folks but deserve special mention: Brian Wolff, Matt Owen, and Tom Heasley too -- all masters of pioneering electrification and processing the tuba sound and interfacing it with technology. We can now also add John Altieri to that too... he recently has been on the road providing the low end on sousaphone, but with a synthesized application, for David Byrne in a complex and physically acrobatic show. Ben Vokits is also getting into this group well bringing some rock to the NYC brass band scene.

There’s also some new-to-NYC folks pushing the envelope: Ben Stapp, Dan Peck, Chanell Critchlow, Ibanda Ruhumbika all are going in new beautiful directions and are all very accomplished players at a young age... and are creating a lot of excitement in NYC.

And, probably the most interesting and versatile (and possibly one of the very best all-around tuba players you might ever meet) is my friend, the infamous and enigmatic Ron Caswell. And let’s put Christopher Meeder in there with Ron too... another superb and interesting madman... both truly inspiring musicians. Kenny Bentley is yet another, and there are more interesting players in town too: Don Godwin who rocks the helicon, George Rush, Tom Abbs... and there’s also Andy Bove, a virtuosic tuba player who recently recorded a beautiful record of love songs... on the cimbasso. Cool.

And that’s JUST in New York!! That’s not including the many amazing more mainstream players that are in town. And what about “tuba mecca” aka Chicago? And what about Nashville? DC? Boston? Atlanta? Austin? LA? Duluth, Dubuque, Denver, Dallas, Davenport etc etc etc....... all chock full of players creating new areas for the tuba. Players who don’t want to sit in the back row any more and see it as a young instrument that has only begun to grow. Also, they are professional players out there working in the world who deserve official professional support.

I don't mean to sound like a cynic, but how many of these players teach or even give masterclasses at universities? How many have industry sponsorships? (Hint: very few) How many do more professional gigs in a year than most pros you know?!! (hint: Many of them, some several times over) Those are the folks that are out there redefining the tuba. How many have a salaried job? Few. They are all schlepping their axes gig to gig to gig to gig, chasing a vision filled with low frequencies of sound.

AND, there’s another angle.... don’t get me started on the bumper crop of outstanding sousaphonists... many of the Mexican banda players are incredible in their own right (and rockstars!), and NoLa guys like the legendary Kirk Joseph, and John Gross, Jason Jurzak, and of course that aaammaaazing Matt Perrine... who just might be one of the best tuba players *of any kind* alive at the moment. His musicality is downright awe-inspiring (upon hearing him, I thought him to be the “Pokorny of the Sousaphone”) And of course Nat McIntosh has his amazing thing too (Nat and I were actually in Colorado All State band together once upon a time)

...and while we are speaking of Colorado, let’s mention my childhood friend Jeanie Schroder, who may actually be the biggest rockstar of the tuba, from the incredibly popular, and very accessible band DeVotchka. Listen to the soundtrack to the Academy and Grammy nominated movie Little Miss Sunshine. It is TUBA CITY... and all Jeanie. (and I’m gonna plug that Jeanne and I were in high school together, she credits me as her first teacher!)
I’m guessing that Jeanie currently plays tuba (she plays sousaphone live) to larger live audiences on a regular basis than any other tuba player of any kind. Major symphonies are now backing up her band in huge arenas... and she also helps manage the band...!
have you heard of her? You should. Her band’s music is truly beautiful. The fact that she’s never been invited to headline an ITEA event boggles my mind! She’s an absolute 100% professional tuba success story. And what about Damon “Tuba Gooding Jr” Bryson? HE’S GOT ONE OF THE BIGGEST AND MOST SOUGHT AFTER MUSIC GIGS IN THE WORLD. yeah, I know it’s sometimes hard to hear him in the mix of the Roots, but i guarantee that’s not his fault. But eff it, he’s a good player, created a niche for himself, and is on TV every night and I am sure is making BANK with a tuba. Another complete and undeniable tuba success story.

On that note, why does ITEA avoid the sousaphone? Someone needs to answer that, stat. The sousaphone is experiencing an INCREDIBLE renaissance as a completely viable professional instrument. Incredible. Why is it not viewed with the same validity as an orchestral BAT? Why are not sousaphone stylings taught at university??

Teachers... if you want to teach your students how to make a living playing music, teach them to read a leadsheet, to memorize, to groove, to adapt, and to create. Stop placing so much emphasis on Fountains and Prokofiev 5 and the Vaughan Williams. Chances are an average music school graduate will NEVER get a chance to play these works professionally. Think about that.
Now, I too adore playing those works and jump at them every chance I get, I’ll admit it. ... but let’s face it, art will always continue to march on.

There are those progressive tuba players you have heard of -- the ones from Europe ...possibly because of Europe’s superior support and acceptance of the arts (yep, got political there for a moment. Don’t comment on that please). There’s that amazing Oystein Baadsvik and the seemingly unstoppable energy of Sergio Carolino. And also Roland Szentpali (hear his recent youtubes on period instruments... wowww!!!) and others....Greek Panagiotis Kamvisidis, French Michel Godard, and now Canadian-in-Holland guy Dave Kutz (a really amazing tuba player you all should know) has been starting to seek new things. And cant forget Melvyn Poore, the imitable Jon Sass (another former NYC guy), and of course my friend the superb Janos Mazura, and lastly one of the guys who got me started on this path, the one and only Oren Marshall. I heard him in grad school and it literally changed my entire life. I remember almost everything about that day I heard him. One more... someone who I recently discovered and I really like his vibe a lot, Cimbasso-destroyer Mattis Cederberg.

The new (or not so new) sect of progressive and exploring tuba players keep on coming and re-adapting... just yesterday I met a wonderful tuba player from Montreal named Julie Houle who just recorded a very sweet record of folksy funky jazz-ish originals that is truly charming. Please check it out. It’s a gem. (...and it’s music that would be great for university recitals!)

The tuba community at large needs to embrace these folks and others more.

And NO this is not because orchestral gigs are dying. These people are not falling back because auditions are so tough... these are people who see the tuba as a musical opportunity and are looking for new things to do with it.

These are not the people winning gigs, THESE ARE THE PEOPLE CREATING GIGS.


Thanks for reading, it means a lot.

-TJ


:)
Last edited by tubajoe on Wed May 01, 2013 2:27 am, edited 4 times in total.
"When you control sound, you control meat." -Arnold Jacobs
tubajoe
pro musician
pro musician
Posts: 589
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:51 pm
Location: NYC
Contact:

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by tubajoe »

KiltieTuba wrote:
tubajoe wrote:...
On that note, why does ITEA avoid the sousaphone? Someone needs to answer that, stat. The sousaphone is experiencing an INCREDIBLE renaissance as a completely viable professional instrument. Incredible. Why is it not viewed with the same validity as an orchestral BAT? Why are not sousaphone stylings taught at university??...
:)
There are a couple articles in the ITEA that feature either Banda or sousaphone players. In the coming Spring Journal there will be an article on the sousaphone. :D
FANTASTIC!! :mrgreen:

...and let me clarify, I actually want to say that the horn does not make the player. (too much emphasis on the equipment itself!!) There are players doing cool things on just about every type of horn.
"When you control sound, you control meat." -Arnold Jacobs
ginnboonmiller
3 valves
3 valves
Posts: 325
Joined: Wed Apr 05, 2006 10:47 pm

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by ginnboonmiller »

tubajoe wrote: And NO this is not because orchestral gigs are dying. I get tired of hearing that. These people are not falling back because auditions are so tough... these are people who see the tuba as a musical opportunity and are looking for new things to do with it.


:)
This. Every bit of this. (and thanks for the mention!)

One thing I really love about our weird little weird-tuba-music scene up here is that every one of us that is out there doing our own thing is doing it because we love it. There are varying levels of success and committment - Joe and Marcus and the like are devoted full time, while schlubs like me get out in front of the audience when it works for us to do so but rely on other means of finance (and health insurance). But not one of us thinks we're sidestepping the collapse of classical music or anything silly like that. We just love the music we make and we love playing the tuba, and why on earth should we have to have it any other way? I avoid orchestral auditions, but not out of fear or canniness - it's the same way David Lee Roth avoids opera auditions. I'm just making different music.
User avatar
Steve Oberheu
pro musician
pro musician
Posts: 251
Joined: Mon Apr 26, 2004 8:09 pm
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Contact:

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by Steve Oberheu »

This is one of the best posts I've seen on Tubenet....ever!! Thanks, Joe!!
"Love Songs & Pirate Songs: The Life and Music of Roger Bobo" — the new authorized biography — is available now at: http://www.upperhaymusic.com/?product=l ... iratesongs
User avatar
David Richoux
5 valves
5 valves
Posts: 1957
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 11:52 pm
Location: San Francisco Bay Area, mostly. Also Greater Seattle at times.

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by David Richoux »

YES!

This is what I have been pushing when I was on KFJC FM and on every forum I can think of.
The Tuba/Sousaphonists from all over the world who have blasted the envelope far beyond classical/symphonic/traditional concert band/circus/marching/German/Polka/Dixie/... etc. scene.

Sure, there are many professional and semi-pro tubists who will play and teach and research and build and sell and repair, I respect and enjoy all of that - but there are those other adventurous folks TubaJoe listed (I can't think of many more) who are exploring where the tuba can go even further! More power to them and keep it going. :tuba:
Ken Herrick
5 valves
5 valves
Posts: 1238
Joined: Sun Oct 25, 2009 5:03 pm
Location: The Darling Desert in The Land of Oz

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by Ken Herrick »

This should be REQUIRED READING for every student of the tuba AND their teachers!

One for inclusion in the players list would,I think, be Dave Gannet. There would be many others willing to go beyond the old or current boundaries and they should be encouraged.

I'm sure that Harvey, as one of the "earlier" proponents of exploring new territory for the tuba would be standing and cheering you on.
Free to tuba: good home
LARSONTUBA
3 valves
3 valves
Posts: 273
Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 7:27 pm
Location: DeLand, FL
Contact:

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by LARSONTUBA »

Joe! Thanks for this post!

This is an extension (with much more detail on specific players) of what I said in my DMA dissertation that I just finished. Most of these names are familiar to me, a few aren't. I agree with everything you say! You should add Baton Rouge, Louisiana to your list of places where new and interesting things are going on. I have a few collaborations going on down here with electronics, live electronics, visual elements, some improvisatory, some notated, etc. Rock and roll!!!

Thanks for posting!

Andy Tuba in Baton Rouge
Andy Larson-DMA
---
Professor of Low Brass, Seminole State College
Paramedic Intern, Seminole State College
ED Tech, Halifax Med. Ctr.
Vol. Fire Police, Volusia County Fire Rescue
Tuba teacher, performer, composer, artist
http://www.vimeo.com/larsontuba
User avatar
bigtubby
4 valves
4 valves
Posts: 747
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:43 pm
Location: Ohio

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by bigtubby »

Thank you.
American sailboats, airplanes, banjos, guitars and flutes ...
Italian motorcycles and cars ...
German cameras and tubas ...
Life is Good.
tofu
5 valves
5 valves
Posts: 1998
Joined: Sun Mar 21, 2004 11:59 pm
Location: One toke over the line...

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by tofu »

Ken Herrick wrote:This should be REQUIRED READING for every student of the tuba AND their teachers!

One for inclusion in the players list would,I think, be Dave Gannet. There would be many others willing to go beyond the old or current boundaries and they should be encouraged.

I'm sure that Harvey, as one of the "earlier" proponents of exploring new territory for the tuba would be standing and cheering you on.
Yeah! - Dave Gannet - Tubas From Hell - great stuff.
Last edited by tofu on Wed May 01, 2013 1:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
quesonegro
bugler
bugler
Posts: 171
Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2007 11:50 am
Location: Cologne, Germany

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by quesonegro »

Thanks for a great post, sure gave me some new cats to check out!!

//Mattis
tubajoe
pro musician
pro musician
Posts: 589
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:51 pm
Location: NYC
Contact:

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by tubajoe »

quesonegro wrote:Thanks for a great post, sure gave me some new cats to check out!!

//Mattis
OH CRAP... Mattis! my apologies!!! I forgot to add this guy!! Mattis Cederberg! ROCKING THE CIMBASSO!!!! DESTROYING THE CIMBASSO!! (seriously...!)

(gonna go back and add you to the list, and man, I owe you a beer!)
"When you control sound, you control meat." -Arnold Jacobs
User avatar
kontrabass
3 valves
3 valves
Posts: 282
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2004 11:30 pm
Location: Toronto
Contact:

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by kontrabass »

Amen Joe. Thanks for this thread. It's been a long time coming.

Players including many of the ones you described were a huge inspiration to me when I was finishing university and wondering where I was headed, knowing that the orchestral path wasn't for me. Nobody told me that it was an option to ditch the audition grind and be a creative musician and carve your own path, but luckily I discovered some of these bands and players and they encouraged me. I can't tell you how much happier and fulfilled I am now that I'm playing sousaphone in creative bands. Suddenly the entire music world is full of friends, allies, professional collaborators.
Rob Teehan
Toronto composer and tuba player
Visit my tuba blog: http://www.robteehan.com
User avatar
circusboy
4 valves
4 valves
Posts: 673
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 6:15 pm
Location: City of Angels

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by circusboy »

Another thank you.

I'm a total hack compared to the folks you list, but I'd like to consider myself one of them in spirit. I'm a true believer in the versatility of the tuba and in the notion that we've just begun to scratch the surface of the possibilities. I aspire to playing by the likes of Bob Stewart, Jay Rozen, Marcus Rojas and Michel Godard. I'll definitely be checking out some of the names less familiar to me.
tofu
5 valves
5 valves
Posts: 1998
Joined: Sun Mar 21, 2004 11:59 pm
Location: One toke over the line...

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by tofu »

hrender wrote:
tubajoe wrote:
quesonegro wrote:Thanks for a great post, sure gave me some new cats to check out!!

//Mattis
OH CRAP... Mattis! my apologies!!! I forgot to add this guy!! Mattis Cederberg! ROCKING THE CIMBASSO!!!! DESTROYING THE CIMBASSO!! (seriously...!)

(gonna go back and add you to the list, and man, I owe you a beer!)
Not to detour this thread, but seriously, folks should hear Mattis play the cimbasso. Given all the smack talk the cimbasso has received, his vid was an eye-/ear-opener.
Nice! Mattis what recordings can we hear you on?
User avatar
quesonegro
bugler
bugler
Posts: 171
Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2007 11:50 am
Location: Cologne, Germany

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by quesonegro »

tofu wrote:
hrender wrote:
Not to detour this thread, but seriously, folks should hear Mattis play the cimbasso. Given all the smack talk the cimbasso has received, his vid was an eye-/ear-opener.
Nice! Mattis what recordings can we hear you on?
Well, I work in a Radio Big Band in Cologne, Germany, The WDR Big Band, where I play Bass Trombone, Tuba and Cimbasso.
Our main purpose is to record music for broadcasts and to do live broadcasts. Alongside of that, CD's are released as well and I'm on pretty much anything recorded after September 2002, when I joined the band :)

More Cimbasso specific, I think YouTube is a good start, there are videos of a bunch of the features I've done with the band as well as some stuff I've don for fun at home...now as my kids have gotten a bit bigger, hopefully I'll be able to record some more of my own ideas!!

I love the instrument and I'm having a lot of fun figuring out what I can do with it!

Thanks for the nice shout-out, hombres!!

//Mattis
User avatar
quesonegro
bugler
bugler
Posts: 171
Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2007 11:50 am
Location: Cologne, Germany

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by quesonegro »

Oh, and here's a link for my YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/cimbassonista" target="_blank" target="_blank

Live Long And Prosper

//Mattis
Michael Bush
FAQ Czar
Posts: 2338
Joined: Sat May 08, 2010 2:54 pm

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by Michael Bush »

tubajoe wrote: On that note, why does ITEA avoid the sousaphone? Someone needs to answer that, stat. The sousaphone is experiencing an INCREDIBLE renaissance as a completely viable professional instrument. Incredible. Why is it not viewed with the same validity as an orchestral BAT? Why are not sousaphone stylings taught at university??
Like many other publications like, say, Fine Woodworking and Elevator World, the ITEA journal is mostly reader-written. Sousaphone related material is there to the degree people write publishable articles and send them in. Please do!
UDELBR
Deletedaccounts
Deletedaccounts
Posts: 1567
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2004 1:07 am

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by UDELBR »

snufflelufigus wrote:You need to check into reality brother man. Some of the guys you mention can't play their way out of a paper bag. Some of those guys would steal a gig from under your feet and don't deserve even being mentioned. Some of those guys I wouldn't call innovators.
+1. This mirrors my recollections of NYC.
User avatar
quesonegro
bugler
bugler
Posts: 171
Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2007 11:50 am
Location: Cologne, Germany

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by quesonegro »

Well, when it comes to innovation, I don't know how much of that is even possible in music whilst staying within a tonal framework. If you look at jazz, there's not an awful lot of new ground being covered after Coltrane (tonally speaking), but there's still a lot of great jazz being played! I personally don't feel that innovation is, in it self, such an important part of whether I dig something/someone, but rather personal expression! That, to me, is a much more important endeavour as an artist, and one that might lead to innovation as well :) And that's no easy task either!! I think that that might, in some ways, be harder now that ever, considering the bottomless well of references, recordings and information at our disposal...all that is great too, of course, but it takes a lot of filtering as well, to hear your own voice in the cacophonous torrent!! (We still try though, hehe)

//Mattis
User avatar
bigtubby
4 valves
4 valves
Posts: 747
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:43 pm
Location: Ohio

Re: ALTERNATUBA

Post by bigtubby »

quesonegro wrote:Well, when it comes to innovation, I don't know how much of that is even possible in music whilst staying within a tonal framework. If you look at jazz, there's not an awful lot of new ground being covered after Coltrane (tonally speaking), but there's still a lot of great jazz being played! I personally don't feel that innovation is, in it self, such an important part of whether I dig something/someone, but rather personal expression! That, to me, is a much more important endeavour as an artist, and one that might lead to innovation as well :) And that's no easy task either!![/b[ I think that that might, in some ways, be harder now that ever, considering the bottomless well of references, recordings and information at our disposal...all that is great too, of course, but it takes a lot of filtering as well, to hear your own voice in the cacophonous torrent!! (We still try though, hehe)

//Mattis


Astute observations Mattis.

One of my creative outlets is photography. How much innovation is available within the tonal range of light striking a two dimensional film (or now digital) plane? The much more important stuff is subtle and nuanced: Phrasing. Composition. Touches that hint at things outside the "genre" (gawd I hate that term).

When I read the original "Should Tuba Joe Be a A Role Model?" thread I knew that the important aspects of Joe's success wasn't where he got gigs, what he plays, venues (orchestra vs. bars), etc., etc. His "stuff" is much more elusive and the sort of thing seemingly not taught in schools: his interpretations. Not that he (or you) shouldn't be a role model, but my hope would be that people would appreciate which parts of an artist's approach are important.
American sailboats, airplanes, banjos, guitars and flutes ...
Italian motorcycles and cars ...
German cameras and tubas ...
Life is Good.
Post Reply